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Post by bobc on Nov 19, 2006 12:27:12 GMT -5
That is TRUE Ua2. When the Avengers fought the human bombs way back in the 70's--when Tony, T'Challa and Don Blake were trying to save the Vision by operating on him--Tony winked at Donald Blake and said something along the lines of "If you find Thor in the same closet I found Iron Man, say hello." Donald Blake then thought to himself "So he knows after all these years."
Yes this is all off the top of my head. Apparently I am not as senile as I feared
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Post by bobc on Nov 15, 2006 9:51:16 GMT -5
yeah--the War on Olympus was pretty good! I'd put that in the top ten fo' sho'.
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Post by bobc on Nov 13, 2006 21:13:47 GMT -5
I agree with all your choices except that Avengers Forever never really grabbed my attention. Not sure why.
I really liked Perez's Exemplars story arch as well.
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Post by bobc on Nov 13, 2006 21:11:00 GMT -5
Bendis and Heroes Reborn. I'm pretty sure it's not possible to get worse than those two abominations. At least I kept buying the Avengers after "Heroes Reborn." I didn't really care one way or the other about the Trial of Yellowjacket--it just seemed like one of those low ebbs that come and go.
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Post by bobc on Dec 20, 2006 11:27:39 GMT -5
Our beloved Black Knight has returned. Praise Allah.
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Post by bobc on Dec 12, 2006 15:04:57 GMT -5
Dl--I find that if art in a comic is really, really bad--it's hard to take that story seriously. I can't help it! It's like Stern--I never paid him no mind until Buscema came on board--and now I'm a big fan.
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Post by bobc on Dec 11, 2006 19:58:20 GMT -5
Yeah I agree totally. The art is volume 1 was terrible. I don't think the art this time around is great or anything, but it's solid and tells the story well.
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Post by bobc on Dec 11, 2006 16:26:27 GMT -5
Due to all of your glowing reviews, I went out and bought these comics. I really liked them. You know what I really, really liked? The fact that when I saw the Vision in one of the issues, I felt EXCITED seeing him. Not in the Biblical sense of course--I mean he seemed mysterious and super-powerful, you know, like a character you wanted to know more about. Over the years the Vision has pretty much been relegated to the scrapyard of C level characters, but when he first came out he was the 3rd most powerful Avenger behind thor and Iron Man. What the hell happened? Now he's in a dumpster somewhere apparently.
have I mentioned I hate Bendis and what he's done to my favorite book?
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Vol 3
Nov 3, 2006 16:07:34 GMT -5
Post by bobc on Nov 3, 2006 16:07:34 GMT -5
I never read Thunderbolts but I heard it was good.
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Post by bobc on Oct 11, 2006 13:22:16 GMT -5
Whether you had a good or bad impression of Reed, you have to admit that those stories made you think and provoked really strong emotions. That to me is the mark of a great writer--great characterization, as Dl says. To even remember, thirty years later, those events in FF history, says a lot about the quality of the stories. There were literally YEARS of bland FF stories that nobody remembers or cares about, but it seems like the 60's and early 70's were very memorable, but after that there was a wasteland until Byrne came along to reinvigorate the book.
The Avengers have been the same way. I wonder how many people will remember anything about the last couple years of the New Avengers. I mean other than outrage.
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Post by bobc on Oct 11, 2006 8:50:45 GMT -5
I remember that FF episode when the Mole Man got dumped for Tyrannus (I think that was his name)--and then everybody betrayed each other! Those were the good old days! It's really remarkable how Marvel remained so consistantly good throughout the 70's and 60's. Seems like things have gotten shallower and shallower (with some stellar exceptions) ever since.
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Post by bobc on Oct 6, 2006 16:57:06 GMT -5
OMIGOD!!!!
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Post by bobc on Oct 6, 2006 13:50:52 GMT -5
I thought they were like Pillsbury Doughboys with eating disorders. But whatever you call them, they were fabulous.
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Post by bobc on Oct 6, 2006 13:38:36 GMT -5
Thanks Shiryu and DL.
Bored--sounds good to me. The Minotaur could be extra enraged if the bug-eyed minions of the MoleMan violated him in a most unnatural manner while he was stuck to that stone wall! Times are hard in the underground catacombs, I hear. And Minotaurs aren't too far from sheep if you think about it.
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Post by bobc on Oct 6, 2006 9:26:32 GMT -5
Hey can someone PLEASE post a link to where I can purchase the CD ROM? I did a search on Amazon and came up empty.
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Post by bobc on Oct 6, 2006 9:25:38 GMT -5
I loved that issue! Isn't it funny that Wanda started out being the most powerful on the team, and they just depowered her and depowered her until she was pretty much useless in a year or two? And why would any sane person want the Hulk on the team? Didn't Iron Man suggest that? Talk about setting them up to fail!! I'm surprised he didn't suggest recruiting Doctor Doom or Galactapuss.
I'm pretty sure the Minotaur is still stuck there--he hasn't reappeared to the best of my knowledge.
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Post by bobc on Nov 18, 2006 18:11:38 GMT -5
Hey did you all ever read Alan Moore's Top Ten, which was about a police department on a planet where every person has super-powers? It was AWESOME. So many comic references, it was mind-boggling. The reason I bring it up, is there is one story where a rookie cop gets called to a bar to investigate a murder--and as it turns out, this bar is populated by Asgardians!! Loki is hanging out at the bar and uses some sneaky magic to kill Balder, who was playing darts! Odin throws a hissy fit and is so insane with grief that he wants to bring down ragnorrak, as the cops tries to calm him down! Then Balder just gets up and is suddenly alive again--and the cop finds out this same Balder death scene has been playing on an endless loop for centuries in that same bar!! The whole thing is like a never ending religious allegory!
Absolutely brilliant writing. Rookie cops always get sent to that "crime scene" as a prank on them!
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Post by bobc on Oct 1, 2006 9:14:51 GMT -5
True--all true. But even if Hercules has been stripped of some of his power, Wonder Man was created to go head to head with any of the Avengers and he has never been written as even close to Thor, power-wise. The Sub-Mariner's pretty close too. Well sort of.
Okay so we know Thor's one of the toughest superheroes out there, so why has his popularity floundered? Is it the Old English venacular? Does it seem corny these days?
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Post by bobc on Sept 30, 2006 14:06:07 GMT -5
Yeah that is a problem shiryu--finding villains strong enough to challenge him. BUT I think a writer with a little imagination could solve this problem. What about an Avengers storyline where someone like Zemo or Loki organizes an attack on him, the way he did with Hercules? After all, Thor is vulnerable to sonic attacks, mental attacks, sorcery and mega-strong physical attacks. He's also been hypnotized many times.
The Avengers have had members over the years who were in Thor's ballpark power-wise (Hulk, Hercules, Wonderman, ect) but none of those people were seen as unbeatable or even head and shoulders above the others. Even in Civil War this week, Hercules is part of the average pack of superheroes, and Thor comes in and knocks the crap out of all of them. I would certainly give Thor the nod over Hercules if push came to shove, but I wonder why Hercules isn't seen as very close in terms of raw power.
As far as Thor's history is concerned, the storyline that I recall being the most exciting ever was when he and the the Silver Surfer fought Durok The demolisher (I think that was his name). Now that was an epic, exciting battle!!!
I like Thor being more superhero than God in presentation.
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Post by bobc on Sept 29, 2006 17:33:03 GMT -5
Hey Guys
I have an interesting discussion topic that really got some of the guys I work with going yesterday, and here it is:
What can be done with Thor to make him attractive or viable with readers today? Nobody can deny that Thor is a HUGE Marvel icon, one of the mainstays, but Thor as a comic has been cancelled several times for low sales, and no writer seems to know what to do with him. Soooo how would you cahnge him? And don't get all crankypants over changing a tried and true character, because what I'm asking here is would you emphasize his super heroeness, or would you focus more on the Godly angle? Would you stage stories more in Asgard, or would you make him a more aminstream superhero who spent most of his time on earth? He's been presented both ways so nobody can complain about either presentation going against his history.
I will say that I liked Thor best when he had the Warriors Three, Balder and Sif as a supporting cast, but he still spent a lot of time on Earth (I liked the early 70's years when Buscema did him). I liked the more super heroey Thor.
What would you do with Thor?
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Post by bobc on Oct 22, 2006 15:41:18 GMT -5
I kinda feel sorry for Liefield. The poor thing is the brunt of every cruel joke. At my last job we had one artist who daily scoured the web looking for sites and articles savaging poor Rob.
I could tell a very shocking story about Rob Liefield but I'm gonna be good.
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Post by bobc on Sept 22, 2006 14:39:36 GMT -5
Wow Steed--the Buscema/Thomas years are what got me hooked for life as well, although I never thought of that until you posted that. I was a little kid in the mid 70's, but I had a friend who had an older brother who had a stack of Avengers comics from the late 60's--and of course I snooped through them. I was so floored by the amazing art by Buscema/Palmer that I just had to know what all the characters could do. I thought, in particular, the Vision, the Panther and the Black Knight looked so cool!
But naturally with my uncanny ability to be at the wrong place at the wrong time, I came into (then) current Avengers continuity in the mid 70's when a lot of the stories were good, but the art, for the most part, was pretty medicore. I still cringe when I think of Don Heck and Bob Brown. I suppose, in a way, that I've been waiting for a return to Buscema/Palmer level art ever since.
It really is kinda strange that Buscema/Palmer have never gotten the props they deserve. B and P are very popular amongst the new crop of Marvel artists, by the way. David Finch is a big fan, and rightfully so.
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Post by bobc on Sept 21, 2006 13:41:54 GMT -5
I hate the tiny, beak-like noses Rob puts on everyone. Look at Thor here--his nose looks like a can opener!
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Post by bobc on Sept 21, 2006 13:40:07 GMT -5
Poor Rob Liefield. There are entire websites devoted to bashing him!! In fact, my last art department at a videogame company used to devote hours to bashing him--I was always getting links sent to me that were steeped in evil, bashing poor Robbie! My GOD you'd think he'd try to get better or refine his style, for no other reason than to avoid more humiliation. I've seen pics of Rob these days were he looks about 50, the poor thing. He still has that early 90's wedge hairstyle, which is a fashion violation of enormous proportions which, if there's any justice in this world, should result in a public flogging at the very least.
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Post by bobc on Sept 26, 2006 9:43:05 GMT -5
I liked Palmer a lot better on inks. Sinnott was okay, but Palmer could make medicore pencils come to life.
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Post by bobc on Sept 26, 2006 9:11:33 GMT -5
Sharker--thanks. For a minute there I thought I was going nutz. No way could Roy Thomas have written that!! I've seen a lot of medicore writers over the years, but only this Drake guy has achieved the covetted award of Worst Writer Ever! I mean the medicore writers were at least coherent usually, but that Lorna Dane stuff was just random! The issues preceeding that little arc were a little dull but were okay and then suddenly BAM!!! I'd love to hear the gossip on Drake--apparently he just disappeared, thankfully.
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Post by bobc on Sept 25, 2006 9:26:51 GMT -5
well isn't Steranko supposed to be some great artist? I thought he was dreadful. That Polaris costume alone should have ended his career.
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Post by bobc on Sept 24, 2006 18:15:18 GMT -5
Okay--I am talking about issue 50 with Polaris on the cover. Trust me, Roy Thomas couldn't have written this crap. I'm not sure who wrote it. I loved the Neal Adams/Roy Thomas stuff--I was wrong about the X-Men being cancelled after 50, in fact the X-Men went on for quite some time apparently. I better keep my snout in Avengers history, where it belongs, because I obviously have no idea what I'm talking about in regards to 80's era X-Men. I'm just now reading up on it!
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Post by bobc on Sept 24, 2006 18:06:07 GMT -5
DL--no--I'm not talking about the issues with Neal Adams, I'm talking about the last few issues that Steranko drew. I thought the X-Men got cancelled after that. I just read those issues in an Essential X-Men volume. I'll snoop around and see if I can find the exact issue numbers.
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Post by bobc on Sept 24, 2006 11:12:25 GMT -5
I agree Steed and Ua2. I am so tired of the whole dark thing. It's been 30 years of dark, dark, dark. It was great for a while but good GOD.
Funny you guys are talking about X-Men, or the beginning of the New X-Men to be precise. Those initial stories were incredible--some of the most classicc, fascinating storylines ever in Marvel history. I've been re-reading them here lately and they still completely hold up. I also agree that after those first few years, Chris claremont became one of the most annoying writers on the planet where it seemed like the X-Men became morose, self-pitying losers issue after issue. The endless self questioning, the dreary soul searching, the mindless self pity...blech.
What happened to a little humor and happiness? Those early issues had lots of humor and lots of happy moments. It's all about balance.
And yeah most of those original X-Men stories from the 60's were craptastic. In fact, I never read those last few issues (just before the series was cancelled) until just a year or two ago, and I can honestly say that those issues are the WORST WRITING I HAVE EVER SEEN IN ANY COMIC BOOK. I am talking about the Steranko issues which introduced Lorna Dane. JUST DREADFUL. The art doesn't even match the words in many of the panels. For example, Marvel Girls whines that a "tidal wave of metal" is enveloping her, but the panel shows like three nuts and bolts clinging to her leg! Listen, if Marvel girl can't fend off a few nuts and bolts, maybe she shoulda tried the Food service industry.
MY GOD you have to read those issues--they are high CAMP. Just horrifyingly bad. The issues preceeding them were at least just boring with third rate villains and dull storylines--but the last few issues before cancellation were the worst writing I've ever seen in 30 years of reading comics. They made Bendis look like Alan Moore.
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