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Post by freedomfighter on May 28, 2010 23:32:59 GMT -5
Hee hee! Man HB you really managed to focus in on one of the few truly horrendous moments in this Essential FF Book--notably the Gate Keeper, or whatever the heck he was called! I have so far just skimmed through this edition, and when I got to that storyline and saw that character, I groaned out loud! Man that was one truly stupid creation! I vaguely remember him from that time--but he is probably best assigned to Marvel's trash heap of bad ideas! There are some great battles in this book, including the one you talked about where High Evolutionary fights Galactus. That is one of the story-lines in which I first noticed how good Perez had gotten, particularly with Sinnott inking him. I never took any notice of Sinnott as a kid--didn't have an opinion one way or the other. Today, as an adult, I think he was really, really good. I think our beloved Sharky is a big fan, if I recall correctly. I don't think I ever saw the story about the X-Men defeating Magneto sans powers. I just remember Storm and how dull she was without her powers. You know I still can't get over the fact that Madame MacEvil (Iron Man) somehow mutated into Moondragon. How on earth did I miss that? Hate to break it to you, but the alternate Johnny Storm popped up again in 90s Marvel armor and with heightened cosmic powers... www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/vangaard.htm
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Post by freedomfighter on May 28, 2010 10:11:09 GMT -5
That's where they were coming from!! I knew I'd seen them somewhere, but couldn't focus on where it was. I liked the movie, it will be interesting to see how and if it's put in continuity. Eh, it's a possible alternate timeline that may or may not take place. Marvel always plays fast and loose with those. Something funny tho'. My wife knows I'm a huge Avengers fan and we were in the LCS and she wondering why I wasn't buying any of the books. I showed her the Bendis book and she read through the first few pages and asked me so simply "if Kang has this weapon that everybody's afraid of, why doesn't he just use it against those kids?" I had no answer for that... I don't think Bendis does either.
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Post by freedomfighter on May 25, 2010 17:11:17 GMT -5
Sigh. I just don't even get the fundamental storytelling that bendis uses. Here's my example of what I just don't get. Kang shows up with a doomsday weapon. The Avengers agree to his demands and essentially he uses that weapon as a bargaining chip. Ok, so if he's got this weapon and he's not afraid to use it as a bargaining chip, why not use it in his conquest? "Give me what I want, or else..." What Busiek went to great pains to illustrate was that Kang is a CONQUEROR. He has a thousand years of tech at his disposal, but for the most part it puts him at an even keel with many of the fantastic powers the super heroes have. He could easily bring a billion soldiers and win a campaign with overwhelming force, but to him it's a battle, a show of his will and his cunning and his might to win on a fairly competitive playing field. But for bendis, Kang is merely a tool in his box, a piece he uses to get his story rolling and not a character to be truly understood and utilized in a fashion that makes any sense. He did this with Ultron too; it's almost as if bendis has no real love for developing his super villains and would just simply use them as a plot device to get to his next bit of repartee. Those who think I'm picking on bendis I would simply ask which villain does anyone think he has truly portrayed as an Avengers foe? One who fits as an integral storyline you would say ranks among the best? Be forewarned, any answers that start with "the Hood" will be met with laughter so long and loud it may deafen and drive insane two generations...
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Post by freedomfighter on May 25, 2010 16:57:42 GMT -5
say scott, where's the list of worst Avengers stories?
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Post by freedomfighter on May 24, 2010 8:29:34 GMT -5
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Post by freedomfighter on May 22, 2010 22:49:37 GMT -5
Y'know, you do these historical read-throughs, and you start to see a larger picture sometimes. Or think that you do. Jim Shooter, love 'im or hate 'im, was a delightful, personal presence on the Bullpen Bulletin pages for much of his tenure as EIC. And, much like Franklin Roosevelt, really seemed to revel in the position he had-- a position that he held for 9-1/2 years, when the average tenure for that position (post Stan Lee) looked to be about a year or so at the most. Now, when he developed and introduced his New Universe, he invested the majority of his space on the BB page in shilling for this baby of his. Aaaaand then the NU faltered almost immediately after lift-off. Aaaaand suddenly JS wasn't nearly so prominent a presence to us readers--- often we didn't hear from him directly at all. Then the NU was effectively euthanized. . . and JS quietly stepped down from the EIC position-- replaced by Tom DeFalco. Was the inside story that directly cause & effect? Was JS that deeply disillusioned and/or mortified? Was he forced out? Heck, where did he go after that? Or was the New Universe not really a factor at all? I'm sure there's folks out there with the inside story! Anyone? Anyone? HB Shooter himself blames it on other factors and not the New Universe...read the first few paragraphs of this interview... www.valiantcomics.com/valiant/joe/shooter/
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Post by freedomfighter on May 22, 2010 21:53:08 GMT -5
I liked a lot of this issue. I think it's unfair to ask Slott to wrap up all his plotlines and make room for various events that I'm sure had their timelines scuttled about for several months. I don't think he wants to wrap up the Janet Van Dyne storyline either, it seems like a possible vehicle for resurrection and that seems a bit too soon to occur at this point. I doubt the powers that be would allow the Wasp to come back so quickly after her apparent demise. I also think Ultron, when faced with the thought of every Avenger at once, and cut off in a strange environment, would choose discretion. Despite his bravado, Ultron is often afraid to face the team, using proxies like a hypnotized Hank Pym, the Vision, Grim Reaper, Alkhema and various old Ultron bodies. He has had any number of quirks about facing a team of a half dozen Avengers (sometimes Ultron is completely fearless- other times plotting out any number of strategies to avoid fighting the Avengers alone). I think with varous revisions Ultron has less confidence at times and more at others, so the idea of forty or fifty or so Avengers pouncing on him at once might give him pause.
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Post by freedomfighter on May 21, 2010 12:19:47 GMT -5
Always interesting stuff Scott. I think there was even more of Stern's run that deserved a spot, some of Englehart's earlier Avengers as well, and I hold the Graviton origin in high esteem as well but your choices are good enough that I won't quibble too much. And you did pick the Ultron mark story which is really an overlooked gem. Here's a look for those who haven't read it... scans-daily.dreamwidth.org/1005354.html
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Post by freedomfighter on May 18, 2010 21:23:16 GMT -5
Well, imagine this is the same population that hailed Norman Osborn as hero and virtually put him in charge before the President did, so not the most consistent lot. But yes, Skrull-heroes were publically revealed to be Skrulls, mostly in the Embedded book that run alongside the event, although I suppose the general public still doesn't quite know who was exactly who. As to why the SHRA wasn't overturned then, I suppose it's because it wasn't in Osborn's interest to do so. Even now, the SHRA has not been overturned as a direct consequence of Siege itself. It was overturned as a consequence of Steve Rogers' raise to power, which was a consequence of Siege. It was one of the conditions set by Steve to accept the new role offered him by the government, but had it all happened in exactly the same way except for this detail, the SHRA would still be there. The government kind of had to bow its head and say yes. As a side note, in Iron-Man's own book, Tony has erared his own memory, and then resetted it to a "backup" done "months" ago, certainly before Civil War. He read of his role in Civil War and of Cap's death in the newspapers and commented "oh my God" OK Shiryu I appreciate your explanation. I personally don't see a lot of this stuff unfolding the way Marvel decided it would, but that's pretty much a given these days...
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Post by freedomfighter on May 18, 2010 15:45:11 GMT -5
I think superheroes became popular again when they defeated the Skrull Invasion in SI. From that moment on, the crowd seemed to be behind them again. Even the Dark Avengers had some fans asking them for autographs. OK. But didn't it look like some of the superheroes were the bad guys in that event too? Or were all the skrulls who were impostors revealed to the public in a forum so everyone could see it? Again, I didn't buy the event, only read it in the LCS and don't recall the finale completely. And if that was the case, why wasn't the SHRA overturned then? And why would the events of Siege not push people back towards registration? To me, this would be a step backwards...
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Post by freedomfighter on May 18, 2010 11:56:15 GMT -5
So I'm confused. Why do people like super heroes again? Enough that the SHRA is overturned? Seriously. What happened in Siege to possibly make people like super heroes again? If anything, the events of this latest dust up in the MU would leave people even more threatened. Was it ever explained that Volstagg was set up? I honestly may have missed it as I only read it in my LCS. If not then people just saw another super hero kill hundreds of people. Then they got to see a battle in Asgard by two groups out of control, trying to destroy each other. What average joe could tell the difference between the Dark Avengers and the Avengers for example? All anybody watching this would know is it looks a lot like Civil War all over again. And the Void came out? I can't imagine that no one got footage of that. So on the news you got to see the Sentry go completely bonkers and evil. Awesome. That's good PR... If anything a huge honking event like this would convince me that super heroes need MORE regulation, not less. How does this launch the Heroic Age, exactly?
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Post by freedomfighter on May 12, 2010 12:00:36 GMT -5
Okay HB, I know you've sort of hijacked this thread but it's a fun little hijacking so: Those changes of direction for Thor and Hulk always bugged me too, as did many other things. The Impossible Man could change shape - okay. But how did he manage to turn into something like a water balloon filled with water. I mean, where did the water come from? How was Alicia Masters able to sculpt statues of people like Mole Man or Dr. Doom? Statues of the the Thing, I can understand but it's not like the villains just stood there and let her come feel their faces. Why would so many villains put our heroes in elaborate traps and then always have a convenient release button just sitting there waiting for the Invisible Girl or the Wasp to push it? And speaking of buttons, how could even a scientific genius like Hank Pym or Reed Richards look at a control panel with fifty buttons and always know instinctively which one to push? I think even a genius would need a control manual for a piece of technology that was completely foreign to them. The funny thing is, all this and more bugged me but the reading was so fun, I just didn't care. I'd just shrug it off. Oh, and I like the puffer fish too. I think it would be really cool to see a group of animal villains band together to battle the Pet Avengers. The puffer would be good in that group and maybe Namor's old hypno-fish could be in there too. Actually two of the things you mention are somewhat easily explained. Thor's hammer obviously defies physics in the first place (its weight must be a mystical property). That tiny little mallet head simply could not generate enough pull to lift someone off the ground for more than a brief period. Yet Thor can fly for hours. For it to work in the first place, it has to have some innate magical properties that make it stay aloft, so Thor zigzagging in flight is no more ridiculous than Thor flying in the first place. Next the interesting thing about technology is that the more advanced it gets, generally the easier it is to use. Think about how hard it use to be start a car (hand crank) and now (many engines have a pushbutton), how hard it used to be to record a TV show (insert a tape into VCR, set VCR timer, set VCR to correct channel, tune TV to correct channel, turn off VCR) and now (bring up your guide onscreen and press a button that says 'record') You want technology to be easy, so it's quick and efficient. Think about your remote control. You use it everyday, but if I wiped all the directions off all the buttons would you know everything on it? All fifty or sixty buttons? Likely not. It's smart to label buttons even if they open your death traps... After all if you've put someone in a death trap, the assumption is someone isn't letting them out, so why the need to make it difficult to operate?
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Post by freedomfighter on May 7, 2010 12:57:59 GMT -5
ugh. no worse character in the last twenty years than the winter soldier. I hate Ed Brubaker's run on Cap maybe more than Bendis on Avengers.
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Post by freedomfighter on May 7, 2010 12:55:48 GMT -5
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Post by freedomfighter on May 5, 2010 23:22:15 GMT -5
Here's another cover of Secret Avengers #1. why is Steve Rogers wearing wicker baskets for shoes??
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 23, 2010 22:51:58 GMT -5
You really put me on the spot with this one. I can't really think of anyone currently who is lighting my fire with their work. Either they don't stay on their book very long, or they're just ruddy inconsistent. The last artist who really wowed me was the person who worked with Jason Aaron on Black Panther during Skrull Invasion- Jefte Palo. His work sort of looks like if Denys Cowan and Mike Mignola teamed up on a book... www.comiclist.com/media/blogs/news/BlackPanther_39_VariantCover.jpg
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 23, 2010 22:44:53 GMT -5
I don't post because every thread needs to contain the obligatory "I HATE BENDIS AND MARVEL QUESADA AND MILLAR AND EVERYTHING THAT COMES OUT RIGHT" post that immediately just kills this place for me. That sheer negativity just keeps me away, and has for a while. It's not personal. I just can't talk about what I like without hearing it bashed and put-down. It's depressing and not worth the time. So I don't even bother writing how excited I am about comics. It's not worth it. That's the exact reason i don't go to jinxworld or avengersforever.org, because you can't really kibbitz about what you don't like. There are plenty of bandwagon forums. I think the crowd here skews older, tends to like a different storytelling model and sadly, have less time to spend online. Still I would like to see some of the gang here if only to talk about the good stuff, like Hank Pym's continued survival and a storyline that might provide possible redemption for Scarlet Witch. That's not Bendis bashing, that's celebrating the stuff that I look forward to.
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 22, 2010 11:49:01 GMT -5
This place is a virtual ghost town. There are some exciting things other than Bendis happening in the land of Avenging, but it just seems that no one here is interested. Is it just that so many are fed up with Marvel? The pricing? Time? Whatever it is, it's crippling the frequency of posting at this site. I feel like the living embodiment of the days when Jan, Hank and Clint were the only ones who showed up at the mansion...
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 22, 2010 9:41:41 GMT -5
Wanda's getting the Heroic Age treatment in Avengers:The Children's Crusade geeksofdoom.com/2010/04/21/c2e2-2010-heinberg-and-cheung-reteam-for-avengers-the-childrens-crusade/Evidently Wiccan starts exhibiting the same powers as Wanda (ridiculous reality altering powers that Wanda never had on her own, only when manipulated...but I digress) and leads the Young Avengers on a quest to find her and redefine themselves. So hopefully Wanda gets a bit better treatment here. And spoiler alert... don't read any further if you want to be surprised by the last issue of Mighty Avengers. Evidently Hank lives and is an instructor at Avengers Academy. www.comicsalliance.com/2010/04/16/speedball-gives-up-gimp-suit-for-avengers-academy-c2e2/Does it suck that Hank is no longer a lead Avenger? Yes and no for me. While yes that he isn't featured, but no as it appears this book will at least have some respect for him. Being a teacher is an honorable and noble enough profession, so it's good to see Hank being trusted by the MU again.
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 16, 2010 12:17:51 GMT -5
When I was a teen, I had a plot in mind where Loki walks up to the mansion door and says he wants to join the Avengers. He's had a change of heart, he says and wants to fight the good fight. What are you gonna do? You kind of have to let him join don't you? If nothing else, to keep an eye on him... If Slott's story had unfolded better, it could have been shown that there was nothing to lose by recruiting Loki. If he says no, you lose nothing, but you have planted a seed that there's always atonement for his actions, which may come to fruition one day. If he says yes and is insincere, you observe him and can make plans to take him down instead of waiting for him to strike. If he says yes and is sincere, then you take away one of your greatest enemies. Storywise it works better if he turns on them, but walks away knowing that he had a chance to be a part of greatness. But it would have been worth exploring in my opinion. Unlike Ares who was just suddenly a good guy and accepted without question... I had meant to come back directly to your post here, FF, 'cause this is indeed a very, very rich premise, and I really like how you've considered alternative plot tracks from the get-go. (And now the industry's been subtly stealing it from you. . . curse'd dogs. . . ) The only thing. . .and I do mean the ONLY thing. . . that gives me a problem is that I can't see "Immortal" characters like Loki exhibiting that kind of fundamental change in their nature in what, for them, is a ridiculously short span of time. I actually WOULD like to see someone as profoundly bad as him have an epiphany and make a sincere, determined effort to reform--- and for the long-term, not simply as a story device. I know we touched on this with the recent discussion of Ares, but I think that, for all of their unimaginable power, these Greek & Asgardian God folks all have a seriously fatal flaw in their makeup: with a few notable exceptions, they are inherently incapable of fundamental or sustained personal growth. The biggest of revelations do. . . not. . . stick (see: Zeus at the end of the Assault on Olympus arc. Where'd all that resolve disappear to?). Loki, the Lord of Lies has yet again pretty much destroyed Asgard & Earth, while committing atrocities and murder, and all of his fellow-gods begrudgingly allow him to ingratiate himself back into the tightest of inner circles. Why are they like that? And why has their power so clearly outstripped their personal evolutionary development? Clearly, the "humans" are far more advanced in that regard. I've never followed Thor enough to know if it's ever been addressed directly, but man, THERE might be the inciting factor for your story. Get to the nub of that, find out what the genomic anomaly is, and then I think you could be off to the races. Perhaps that gene is also tied to what keeps them immortal? What if Loki were to have that gene altered somehow, and become mortal? Would he also start to develop a more human "soul", as it were? A conscience? If so. . . why, yes-- absolutely yes, I think joining the Avengers even becomes the inevitable move for him (ruling out the obvious bid from the Thunderbolts, of course). Wow, and so now here's ANOTHER great story that needs to be written-! Boy, you and Shiryu sure have a lot of homework to do. . . ! HB You know I don't think that's the case about their being locked into certain patterns, but only because of an Alan Moore story where he took Myxzptlyk (yeah I didn't spell that right...) and explored the idea that he might become really bad just to see what it felt like. As Moore pointed out, over the course of thousands and thousands of years, someone extremely long lived might just try on a couple of new personas just to see if they "fit." And that to me sounds like something a bored God with no purpose might do. Loki has no real responsibilities so he can explore his options in terms of behavior. And if you look at Simonson's run on Thor, Loki is often seen doing good things for the wrong reason. I could see him wanting to pull a "long con" on the Avengers (although two or three years wouldn't be all that long to a God) just to make turning on them all the sweeter, and then finding their inherent decency messing with his head and taking the fun out of it for him.
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 16, 2010 10:02:54 GMT -5
I honestly don't think I've ever been so down on Cap before. I really don't get the love for Brubaker even a little bit. "Steve is a master of disguise" Really? Since when? And why is he carrying a gun? Makes me glad I won't be buying this book among so many others. 2010 may be the year I spend less than a hundred dollars on comics. That's what I spent in like, 1980. I feel so retro...
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 16, 2010 9:48:27 GMT -5
Hasn't Moon Knight been something of a homicidal maniac in the last few years? Steve Rogers is feeling somewhat redundant these days. And with Valkyrie are the Avengers now up to seven or eight gods on their various rosters? (Thor, Herc, Ares, Gilgamesh, Sersi, and maybe Mantis- who ascended to godhood... and Silverclaw who's the daughter of a goddess) I'm kinda "God-ded out." I am happy to see Hank, Rhodey and Nova in the fold tho' . Shame Hank Pym or Jocasta didn't make the cut. Jocasta is much more versatile than Valkyrie in my opinion and Hank, well if he wants to be secret all he has to do is stay small...
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 12, 2010 21:35:58 GMT -5
I know this won't shock anyone but I actually found the reveal to be incredibly annoying. If you look at the original blacked out images and the revealed images, you can see they've been significantly altered. War Machine's epaulets were taken off as were the Beast's talons and fur and they changed the shape of his head. What's the point of a guessing game if you're going to change the images on the reveal? www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=25616
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 9, 2010 23:15:09 GMT -5
When I was a teen, I had a plot in mind where Loki walks up to the mansion door and says he wants to join the Avengers. He's had a change of heart, he says and wants to fight the good fight. What are you gonna do? You kind of have to let him join don't you? If nothing else, to keep an eye on him... If Slott's story had unfolded better, it could have been shown that there was nothing to lose by recruiting Loki. If he says no, you lose nothing, but you have planted a seed that there's always atonement for his actions, which may come to fruition one day. If he says yes and is insincere, you observe him and can make plans to take him down instead of waiting for him to strike. If he says yes and is sincere, then you take away one of your greatest enemies. Storywise it works better if he turns on them, but walks away knowing that he had a chance to be a part of greatness. But it would have been worth exploring in my opinion. Unlike Ares who was just suddenly a good guy and accepted without question... Or it could have happened sometime after the Avengers-Defenders War, when Loki was left in a child-like state in it's aftermath, if the Avengers would have kept him in their custody instead of leaving him in Rutland with Tom Fagan. What do you think, ff...? . that's an excellent bit of history to jump off from. I think that could be in its own way a really moving story, much like the Joseph/Magneto storyline had the possibility to be (for those who don't know what I'm talking about, Joseph was supposedly a young Magneto somehow rejuvenated who realized all the death and destruction he caused during his evil mutant days. sadly he turned out to be a...clone, grrrr.) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_%28comics%29i think the loki right after avengers/defenders war who was slow to get his personality back and would eventually reawaken, to have been doing good for a while would have been interesting. my version was right around avengers 300, just before cap reformed the team. they were demoralized and fractured. no better time to put the final nail in their coffin. Loki would've turned on them, but not destroyed them and taken some small pride in knowing something he in essence created was such an indefatigable force for justice, much like a bad parent can be proud of a good child...
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 8, 2010 22:29:38 GMT -5
When I was a teen, I had a plot in mind where Loki walks up to the mansion door and says he wants to join the Avengers. He's had a change of heart, he says and wants to fight the good fight. What are you gonna do? You kind of have to let him join don't you? If nothing else, to keep an eye on him... If Slott's story had unfolded better, it could have been shown that there was nothing to lose by recruiting Loki. If he says no, you lose nothing, but you have planted a seed that there's always atonement for his actions, which may come to fruition one day. If he says yes and is insincere, you observe him and can make plans to take him down instead of waiting for him to strike. If he says yes and is sincere, then you take away one of your greatest enemies. Storywise it works better if he turns on them, but walks away knowing that he had a chance to be a part of greatness. But it would have been worth exploring in my opinion. Unlike Ares who was just suddenly a good guy and accepted without question...
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 6, 2010 12:17:52 GMT -5
I know. Not a big fan of retcons, but anything that takes me back to those glory days is a welcome addition to my library. I think Casey lost some fans with EMH#2 and his revelation that everyone knew that Hank Pym was Yellowjacket, but I think he does love the old team.
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 6, 2010 12:13:35 GMT -5
steve rogers in a black turtleneck. what's the point? he looks like he escaped from a 1970s after shave ad...
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Post by freedomfighter on Apr 1, 2010 11:56:18 GMT -5
Sad news indeed. As the CBR tribute posted by ff states, Dick Giordano was one of the people brought in by Carmine Infantino to revitalize ("Marvelize" ) DC in 1968. I remember becoming aware of him because he worked on several of the DC comics I read back then, as editor (Teen Titans) and inker (Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Batman). On the books he edited, his irreverent presence in the letter columns--which at times included a caricature of him--made DC seem less stuffy and more "with it." He spoke to the reader in the way Stan did (both men citing the 1950s EC Fan-Addicts as their inspiration). No inker ever made Sekowsky look so good, and even Adams admiringly remarked that his being inked by Giordano was like being inked by Adams himself (Adams was his own favorite inker). Giordano also penciled at times (he did the Batman classic "There is No Hope in Crime Alley"), and it could be said that his style became the DC house look in the late 1960s-1970s. I highly recommend the book shown in the CBR tribute, "Dick Giordano: Changing Comics, One Day at a Time," for anyone who wants to know more about this remarkable and creative man. Also, "Draw Comics with Dick Giordano." RIP, Mr. Giordano. I'm glad someone else realizes the big impact and major contribution that Dick Giordano brought to comics. No Watchmen, Swamp Thing, Teen Titans, or Dark Knight Returns without him, folks.
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Post by freedomfighter on Mar 28, 2010 19:56:58 GMT -5
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Post by freedomfighter on Mar 23, 2010 21:53:05 GMT -5
Is no one else concerned by a cover that shows what appears to be Wonder Man about to explode and attack the Avengers? I realize that covers like this popped up all the time in Golden/Silver/Bronze age but with Bendis I have been conditioned that when he shows a member of the Avengers as a bad guy, he's going whole hog with it...
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