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Post by redstatecap on May 21, 2007 20:36:16 GMT -5
Heh...Ares Natasha. RSC
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Post by Nutcase65 on May 26, 2007 17:22:15 GMT -5
Doom gets an Exhalt for the Pokemon/I don't like sand crack I don't think any of us actually like sand in our cracks
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Post by spiderwasp on May 26, 2007 23:00:12 GMT -5
Just picked up the issue today. I can't say this ranks as one of my all time favorite Avenger runs but I do feel like my Avengers are back. Ares still doesn't seem like a great choice, but so far, I'm enjoying him more than I thought I would. I did like the way the Black Widow was handled. She's never been a particular favorite of mine, but her competence here was good. I think she did more leading here, when she's not the leader, than she did during the time she was supposed to be co-leader in the previous run. Girl Ultron hasn't really bothered me that much. I'm keeping an open mind on where Bendis is going with this, and it was good to see Sentry actually do something. Again, don't take this as rants and raves for the dialogue impaired Bendis but it didn't leave me longing to see him run out of town on a rail, so that's a major step in the right direction.
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Post by balok on May 29, 2007 12:46:38 GMT -5
He's taking so long to get where he's going that I think he's trying to beat Meltzer over on JLA in terms of total number of entirely wasted panels for one author's run. I can't say wasted issues, because the story does progress - at a glacial pace.
Guess I just don't like Bendis, at least on supers. He did well in the crime/noir genre, although even there his incompetence with dialog was sometimes difficult to endure.
I read the first three issues, and I don't expect to return for #4. I was hoping for more from this book.
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Post by thew40 on May 29, 2007 23:34:43 GMT -5
Bendis' dialogue is pretty much a style thing, I've noticed. Either you love it or you hate it. I love it. It's got a nice energy to it (though it was botched in "Disassembled"). But I can see how others would not care for it.
And kudos for sticking with it for three issues, Baloc. I've liked it more than you have (obviously), so I'll be sticking with it. But hey, at least you gave it shot. I respect that.
~W~
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Post by balok on Jun 1, 2007 18:38:03 GMT -5
The first issue was pretty good, but it has tailed off for me since then. Bendis is taking so long to get where he's going that I've begun to wonder whether he understands comic book storytelling.
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Post by thew40 on Jun 3, 2007 11:26:50 GMT -5
The first issue was pretty good, but it has tailed off for me since then. Bendis is taking so long to get where he's going that I've begun to wonder whether he understands comic book storytelling. That's the way comics are written these days, with longer stories. It's not just a Bendis thing. A lot of writers write like that now. Morrison, Millar, Miller, Rucka, even Busiek, David, Waid, and Claremont. You just gotta learn to deal with it. ~W~
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Post by bendisbites on Jun 3, 2007 17:06:32 GMT -5
The first issue was pretty good, but it has tailed off for me since then. Bendis is taking so long to get where he's going that I've begun to wonder whether he understands comic book storytelling. That's the way comics are written these days, with longer stories. It's not just a Bendis thing. A lot of writers write like that now. Morrison, Millar, Miller, Rucka, even Busiek, David, Waid, and Claremont. You just gotta learn to deal with it. ~W~ I don't buy that at all. Plenty of guys have done long stories and multi part stories and still managed to make them exciting and done with good storytelling. I doubt Bendis could write a good hostess cupcake ad. His version would be six panels of regretful headshots of Spider Woman turning traitor for a pack of Twinkies.
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Post by thew40 on Jun 3, 2007 18:14:43 GMT -5
I don't buy that at all. Plenty of guys have done long stories and multi part stories and still managed to make them exciting and done with good storytelling. It's a fact that these creators write long story, so you'll have to buy that. The rest of your comments are opinion, not fact. ~W~
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Post by balok on Jun 3, 2007 18:39:15 GMT -5
I don't mind a long story as long as it goes somewhere interesting each issue. I don't even mind the occasional "day off" or "set up future subplots" issue. What I don't like is long, draggy issues which are chiefly the Bendis style. I'm not a fan of Millar and Morrison is usually boring. Unless Busiek has changed significantly in recent years he doesn't fit this definition.
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Post by thew40 on Jun 3, 2007 21:37:59 GMT -5
I don't mind a long story as long as it goes somewhere interesting each issue. I don't even mind the occasional "day off" or "set up future subplots" issue. What I don't like is long, draggy issues which are chiefly the Bendis style. I'm not a fan of Millar and Morrison is usually boring. Unless Busiek has changed significantly in recent years he doesn't fit this definition. I guess we just disagree. I feel as though this story has been just fine as far as plot development goes. ~W~
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Post by imperiusrex on Jun 4, 2007 1:49:29 GMT -5
I don't buy that at all. Plenty of guys have done long stories and multi part stories and still managed to make them exciting and done with good storytelling. It's a fact that these creators write long story, so you'll have to buy that. The rest of your comments are opinion, not fact. ~W~ Aw w, if I may chime in, the original statement by balok is about how bendis writes long stories that go nowhere. I think bendisbites statement is that you can write long stories that are exciting even if they go six or eight issues. And your statement isn't fact. Kurt Busiek often writes solo stories for Astro City. Even his magnum opus taking place in the current astro City is in four part segments that'll fit into an overall tapestry, but that's no different than any other title that's ongoing. mark waid often does 4 or 6 six issue storylines with legion having been the exception to the rule. his brave and bold has a running theme, but several issues can be enjoyed on their own merits. Peter david has done any number of standalone issues of X Factor. I don't read many book by Morrison, Rucka and Millar, but if pressed I'm sure I can find a number of lesser known writers (or Joe Quesada favorites anyway) who do much shorter story arcs. In fact I believe I previously posted a quote from Paul Jenkins who said he prefers writing arcs that don't go more than two or three issues. Are there more story arcs? I suppose but not much more than there have been since the early nineties, which would make this a not particularly recent development...
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Post by von Bek on Jun 4, 2007 8:35:55 GMT -5
Millar wrote many "fill-in" issues during Morrisson´s JLA run that were solo stories. Same thing with Morrisson himself. His "Seven Soldiers" mini series are 4 issues long each.
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Post by balok on Jun 4, 2007 8:45:41 GMT -5
Morrison's problem is that he wishes he was Alan Moore or Neil Gaiman, and he's not. He's occasionally readable, but only occasionally.
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Post by balok on Jun 4, 2007 8:47:13 GMT -5
I guess we just disagree. I feel as though this story has been just fine as far as plot development goes. I guess so. I might have given this book longer if Bendis didn't have a history of writing books I don't enjoy reading.
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Post by von Bek on Jun 4, 2007 8:53:59 GMT -5
Neal Gaiman is one of the biggest frauds ever. And, with the exception of Garth Ennis, all UK writers currently working in US comics whish they were (or at least should have been) Alan Moore.
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Post by thew40 on Jun 4, 2007 17:50:22 GMT -5
Morrison's problem is that he wishes he was Alan Moore or Neil Gaiman, and he's not. He's occasionally readable, but only occasionally. Morrison's stuff can either be really great (most of New X-Men, JLA, Marvel Boy, All-Star Superman) or just too nutty for its own good (Filth, Seven Soldiers). Neal Gaiman is one of the biggest frauds ever. Wha -- ?! I find Alan Moore to be overrated. ~W~
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Post by balok on Jun 4, 2007 21:37:54 GMT -5
Gaiman one of the biggest frauds ever? We'll have to disagree. Like Morrison, he can be inconsistent, but he's more often interesting (to me) than not.
Moore overrated? We'll very much have to disagree. I can't recall reading an Alan Moore book that I dislike, although I haven't read everything the man wrote, so there could be one out there, I guess.
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Post by von Bek on Jun 5, 2007 8:56:23 GMT -5
Gaiman one of the biggest frauds ever? We'll have to disagree. Like Morrison, he can be inconsistent, but he's more often interesting (to me) than not. The only Gaiman book that resists a deeper analysis is Violent Cases. The vast majority of Sandman stories are either Alan Moore ideas that Gaiman took from Swamp Thing or pseudo intelectual garbage. And once he became famous he stopped writing comics.
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Post by thew40 on Jun 5, 2007 12:18:48 GMT -5
Gaiman one of the biggest frauds ever? We'll have to disagree. Like Morrison, he can be inconsistent, but he's more often interesting (to me) than not. The only Gaiman book that resists a deeper analysis is Violent Cases. The vast majority of Sandman stories are either Alan Moore ideas that Gaiman took from Swamp Thing . . . Such as what? Again, such as what? Writing about storytelling? Telling stories about mythology and family? And he didn't stop writing comics. He just wrote The Eternals, and before that, he worked 1602 and Endless Nights. Yeah, he's been writing books, but he didn't stop writing comics. If you're going to present an arguement to me, why don't you actually give me facts instead of just bullcrap responses such as "pseudo intelectual garbage." Tell, what stories did he "take" from Alan Moore? Moore overrated? We'll very much have to disagree. I can't recall reading an Alan Moore book that I dislike, although I haven't read everything the man wrote, so there could be one out there, I guess. Well, to be fair, I haven't read all of his work either. Don't get me wrong. He's done some great work. Watchmen is probably among the best comics out there and it certainly changed the way future comics were written. While I've enjoyed just about everything he has written that I've read, there's really been no other story that's done that's on the same scale in terms of storytelling and style as Watchmen. And if there is, it isn't getting the acclaim to garner my attention. Like I said, I find him to be among the best writers in the business, but in a way, Watchmen is almost like a one hit wonder. Everything else, while good, just doesn't compare. ~W~
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Post by bobc on Jun 5, 2007 17:02:00 GMT -5
I bought this issue and I agree there were some good moments, especially with Black Widow. I just don't find any of these characters very interesting. The dialogue was better
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Post by von Bek on Jun 6, 2007 9:59:52 GMT -5
The only Gaiman book that resists a deeper analysis is Violent Cases. The vast majority of Sandman stories are either Alan Moore ideas that Gaiman took from Swamp Thing . . . Such as what? Glad you asked. Moore started his ST run with the main character as a prisioner who frees himself, fight a minor old JLA villain with powers similar to his own, defeats him in a non traditional way (at least for superhero comics) and learns the truth about himself, regaining control of his realm (in the case of the ST the Green). Later ST travels to Hell encountering a loved one and a foe there (and let´s not forget Etrigan). Sounds familiar? Even the concept that the lost souls in Hell are there because they felt guilty and wanted to be punished and not because God send them there came from a ST arc. The Serial Killers Con and other ideas and characters in that story with the Corinthian are originally from a story in American Gothic, another ST arc. I could go on and on, for most of the 75 issues that the series lasted. And he didn't stop writing comics. He just wrote The Eternals, and before that, he worked 1602 and Endless Nights. Yeah, he's been writing books, but he didn't stop writing comics. He did stop writing comics. From the late 90´s to the early 2000´s the only comic I could find he wrote was a self indulgent Web Comic, that was 5 or 6 pages long. The two mini series for Marvel are recent, and not exactly a come back. I don´t know if he was out of money or tired of Joe Quesada begging him to write something for Marvel, but even many people who like Gaiman don´t rank those works among his best. If you're going to present an arguement to me, why don't you actually give me facts instead of just bullcrap responses such as "pseudo intelectual garbage." Done, the facts are presented. Bullcrap is pseudo intelectual garbage being marketed as High Art... Tell, what stories did he "take" from Alan Moore? See above, but there are many more. Like I said, I find him to be among the best writers in the business, but in a way, Watchmen is almost like a one hit wonder. Everything else, while good, just doesn't compare. ~W~ Swamp Thing and the Killing Joke are way better, as is some of his 2000 A.D. stuff.
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Post by imperiusrex on Jun 6, 2007 12:21:46 GMT -5
The only Gaiman book that resists a deeper analysis is Violent Cases. The vast majority of Sandman stories are either Alan Moore ideas that Gaiman took from Swamp Thing . . . Such as what? Again, such as what? Writing about storytelling? Telling stories about mythology and family? And he didn't stop writing comics. He just wrote The Eternals, and before that, he worked 1602 and Endless Nights. Yeah, he's been writing books, but he didn't stop writing comics. If you're going to present an arguement to me, why don't you actually give me facts instead of just bullcrap responses such as "pseudo intelectual garbage." Tell, what stories did he "take" from Alan Moore? Moore overrated? We'll very much have to disagree. I can't recall reading an Alan Moore book that I dislike, although I haven't read everything the man wrote, so there could be one out there, I guess. Well, to be fair, I haven't read all of his work either. Don't get me wrong. He's done some great work. Watchmen is probably among the best comics out there and it certainly changed the way future comics were written. While I've enjoyed just about everything he has written that I've read, there's really been no other story that's done that's on the same scale in terms of storytelling and style as Watchmen. And if there is, it isn't getting the acclaim to garner my attention. Like I said, I find him to be among the best writers in the business, but in a way, Watchmen is almost like a one hit wonder. Everything else, while good, just doesn't compare. ~W~ Well Moore could probably still be counting royalties from V For Vendetta, the blockbuster film, if he didn't sign away his rights or something along those lines... League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen may not have doen as well critically or box office wise, but Moore is not a one hit wonder. He's probably one of the most bankable writers out there in terms of sales and quality. Just because Watchmen is arguably the best selling graphic novel of all time (and definitely the best reviewed and critically acclaimed) doesn't make his other work any less good--unless you think Orson Welles sucked because nothing ever hit the same level as Citizen Kane...
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Post by von Bek on Jun 6, 2007 12:53:29 GMT -5
League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen may not have doen as well critically or box office wise, but Moore is not a one hit wonder. He's probably one of the most bankable writers out there in terms of sales and quality. Just because Watchmen is arguably the best selling graphic novel of all time (and definitely the best reviewed and critically acclaimed) doesn't make his other work any less good--unless you think Orson Welles sucked because nothing ever hit the same level as Citizen Kane... Agreed about Moore, his less known work like The Ballad of Halo Jones is also very good. I don´t know if Moore is overrated, but Watchmen definitely is. And while Welles never made another movie as good as Citizen Kane, Moore wrote many stories that are better than Watchmen.
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Post by imperiusrex on Jun 6, 2007 13:26:59 GMT -5
League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen may not have doen as well critically or box office wise, but Moore is not a one hit wonder. He's probably one of the most bankable writers out there in terms of sales and quality. Just because Watchmen is arguably the best selling graphic novel of all time (and definitely the best reviewed and critically acclaimed) doesn't make his other work any less good--unless you think Orson Welles sucked because nothing ever hit the same level as Citizen Kane... Agreed about Moore, his less known work like The Ballad of Halo Jones is also very good. I don´t know if Moore is overrated, but Watchmen definitely is. And while Welles never made another movie as good as Citizen Kane, Moore wrote many stories that are better than Watchmen. Well it depends on your tastes. Some movie wonks say that Magnificent Ambersons in its original cut is amazing, far better than what was released. And The Stranger is still an amazing movie of a different genre than Kane. Not to mention his version of MacBeth which was done on a shoestring budget. Regardless, I think Moore is an amazing talent, I just started reading old issues of Miracle/Marvel Man again and that is just as good as anything else he's ever done--I even enjoyed when he took over Rob Liefeld's third rate characters and that was a feat beyond belief!
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Post by bobc on Jun 15, 2007 9:49:10 GMT -5
I picked up this latest issue, not realizing it was Bendis. Here's what I don't get--isn't this Sentry supposed to have the power of "a thousand exploding suns?" If this is the case, he is far and away more powerful than all the Marvel universe several hundred times over. Why would he need any super hero team? How did a cell ever hold him? Why is he struggling to stop a Shield Helicarrier that is falling to earth? Shouldn't that pretty much be like batting an eyelash to the Sentry? Wouldn't that require, say, just the power of maybe a quarter of one exploding sun? Also--doesn't somebody say in this issue that Wonderman is as powerful as the Sentry? How can that be? He's not even as powerful as Thor, let alone 1,000 exploding suns.
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Post by balok on Jun 15, 2007 11:16:49 GMT -5
Perhaps that whole "1000 exploding suns" thing was made up by his marketing department. You know how those wacky folks in marketing love to brag...
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Post by bobc on Jun 15, 2007 12:59:07 GMT -5
When mega-powerful characters like Phoenix or Silver Surfer used to appear on the scene, it was really exciting because their power was always demonstrated in an epic battle. Remember when Phoenix blasted Firelord into New Jersey, or the time Silver Surfer paired with Thor to fight the Demolisher? These were knock down, drag out fights that are still remembered twenty, thirty years later. What has Sentry done in 3 years? Nothing from the sound of it.
A guy I work with went to the comic store last night and came back with four comics, all of which depicted battles on the cover (for instance Nova vs Iron Man). Not one of them actually had a battle in the book itself. I have pretty much stopped buying comics because of this lack of action.
I listened to an interview with George Perez the other day and he said he choreographs fight scenes when he draws comics-- and that people don't do that anymore. I think it's pathetic.
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Post by Doctor Doom on Jun 15, 2007 16:51:03 GMT -5
Er... bobc. The cover you cited clearly shows Iron Man and Nova facing off. Which they do.
Staring menacingly is not a battle.
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Post by bobc on Jun 18, 2007 10:49:32 GMT -5
okay--you have me on a technicality. But be fair--didn't you get the impression you were buying a battle between the two? You know, like the Black panther comic that showed Namor fighting BP on the cover, but in the actual comic it never happens?
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