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Post by bobc on Jul 31, 2011 11:16:36 GMT -5
CA is the number one movie in America right now, making about 65 mill in its opening weekend--almost exactly what Thor did. Green Lantern did 52 mill in it's first week, but then sank like a stone due to bad word of mouth. I haven't seen CA yet but my friends who have seen it liked, but didn't love, it. I hope it does well--but frankly I think these super hero movies are coming out too quickly. It's hard to get excited when four major super hero movies come out in a space of a month or two. They need to be major events, IMO/
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Post by bobc on Jun 27, 2011 15:17:37 GMT -5
Apparently Hawkeye tried to scalp a stunt man on the set of the new Avengers movie! Hee hee! This story appears halfway down the page: www.tmz.com/ |
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Post by bobc on Jun 23, 2011 15:53:17 GMT -5
I think you are right on all those points, Tom--but you didn't touch on why animated super hero series are not catching on. Over the past ten years I've seen Sponge Bob, Powerpuff Girls, Dexter's Laboratory, and things like that catch on like wildfire, so I am thinking there is something about the concept of super heroes that isn't clicking with kids. As most people here know, I do video games for a living, so I am very interested in this not just because I'm a comic collector, but for my line of work. Whenever I meet kids under the age of 16 or so, I always ask if they like super heroes, and if so, which ones. In the 90's, virtually every kid liked super heroes, and would usually name Wolverine or Batman or somebody like that. In the past decade, I have yet to meet a kid who even likes super heroes, let alone has a favorite. They all know Mario, Zelda and other video game characters, however.
Getting back to your thoughts on the commercial decline of comics, I can add that a few years ago I was friends with a very famous Marvel artist, and he told me that the biggest reason prices have skyrocketed in the past decade has been the rise in the price of paper. As coloring techniques got more complicated via graphics programs like Photoshop, the quality of the paper had to be higher to convey the more subtle shading and color blends. If the fine "air-brushing" was ever printed on the old school, low end stock, it would become a muddy mess.
So I guess you could say all the reasons stated on this thread created a "perfect storm" for comic books. I'm just happy I got into comics when I did and have those back issues to check out.
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Post by bobc on Jun 23, 2011 12:56:44 GMT -5
But FF you have to understand that DisneyXD is considered a boondoggle because none of it's shows are getting good ratings. Compared to the regular Disney channel, Disney XD is a disaster. EMH was getting a beatdown by SpongeBob re-runs on another channel! It may not be a fair comparison but it is reality, unfortunately.
I never saw the Justice League cartoon but heard it was very good.
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Post by bobc on Jun 23, 2011 11:08:36 GMT -5
It's terrible. Corporations are no longer interested in mediocre showings. These ratings are considered disastrous by the powers that be (I have to be careful here so as not to burn a source) and everybody that worked so hard to make that series so great are very disappointed. The Conventional Wisdom is that EMH is by far the best animated series ever done by Marvel, which makes the lack of viewership especially vexing.
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Post by bobc on Jun 23, 2011 10:02:04 GMT -5
You know FF, after re-reading your post, something dawned on me. While I am crystal clear as to how Marvel has driven off older readers like us, and agree with all your points (grrrrrr "decompressed story-telling"), I am more curious as to why kids aren't getting into comics and haven't been since the mid 90's. I think your post pretty much answered that question in an indirect way. I make a good living and frankly didn't even notice the price increase, but if I were a kid with very little money, that price increase would be a huge problem. And if you add to that the fact that Marvel has made it so you have to purchase 500 books just to understand what the hell is going on, then what kid in his right mind would choose to spend his limited resources on comics? Put another way, a kid can elect to either buy two comics, or spend that same money on a big budget feature film like Thor or Iron Man.
De-compressed story telling. Uhg. Another genius Bendis idea. That used to mean BORING. Why would I spend my money on ten comics that could have told that same story in one? It never dawned on me until now that maybe that's the point--why not force the fans to buy ten instead of one?
And this "realistic dialogue." Bendis moonies seem to think this "realistic" dialogue is some ingenious new technique, but it is actually amateurish and ridiculous. The first thing they teach you in Creative Writing is that you leave out the glitches and stammers and repeated phrases unless they actually add something to the dialogue. This is Creative Writing 101. If you look at a transcript of, say, a newscast interview, the person who does the transcribing usually "cleans up" the dialogue, leaving out the glitches and stammers and stutters. This is done so the reader doesn't get confused or annoyed--since what is easy to follow verbally is not necessarily easy to follow when read.
This is sad.
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Post by bobc on Jun 23, 2011 8:40:34 GMT -5
Thanks for sharing your views, guys.
FF--yeah, EMH was only drawing about 700,000 viewers per episode. That's terrible.
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Post by bobc on Jun 22, 2011 19:43:39 GMT -5
Hi FF--I am also curious as to why, although Marvel characters are in a sense more popular than ever thanks to live action movies, comic and animated versions of the same characters are bombing out these days. I know part of it is the fact that there is so much competition out there, along with the sinking economy. On the other hand, Sponge Bob and Phineas and Ferb seem to be dominating the kids animation market. Is it possible that the live action movies are drawing a huge audience because older people like myself are seeing these characters for the first time live, and bringing kids with them? I think that is a huge part of the popularity of the live films, but it doesn't explain the lack of interest in comic books or the EMH series. I'd love to blame this on Bendis, but it is not true. What is going on here? Are super heroes an antiquated concept? Are kids, brought up on gansta rap, seeing super heroes as corny?
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Post by bobc on Jun 22, 2011 8:04:46 GMT -5
Golden--I don't buy his work. I haven't in years, with the exception of occasionally buying something he's written without realizing it. Anyway--this thread was started before I knew it was even Bendis doing the killing-- I read the headline on a news site that PP was being killed off and I groaned just because it's been like the 100th "death" in recent years. Then when I read it was Bendis it really annoyed me.
I've said what I had to say.
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Post by bobc on Jun 21, 2011 19:36:47 GMT -5
Right. And since we know they always come back, who cares? Killing off a beloved character is not a substitute for great, solid storytelling. It is now a boring cliche and yet another reason for me to believe that maybe at one time Bendis had some good ideas and maybe wrote some good stories, but I am talking about today. I occasionally go on other comic forums, and when people express their disapproval about his handling of the Avengers, Bendis fans invariably dredge up his work from 10 years ago (or more) on other titles. For me, that's like saying the band Van Halen is GREAT, while citing songs from the 80's or early 90's. The truth is, Van Halen has been like a walking corpse for 15 years--and great songs from their earlier years don't mean that the band is great today.
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Post by bobc on Jun 21, 2011 16:37:39 GMT -5
Yeah--I have heard that his Daredevil and Spiderman were good, I never read them, but how long ago was that? To be fair, it would seem that if any character is suited to Bendis' style, it would be Spiderman. But honestly, I walked into Austin Books a month ago and saw all these melodramatic covers regarding the death of the Human Torch, I pretty much just gave up and walked out--haven't been back since. And now Peter Parker is being killed off.
Oh well, to each his own. I won't be buying it.
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Post by bobc on Jun 21, 2011 15:10:03 GMT -5
Well that's your prerogative--I find all these deaths really cheap and boring. Also, bringing somebody different back as Spiderman is lame, Ultimate Universe or not. The Black Panther isn't the Panther anymore, Captain America isn't Captain America anymore, Hawkeye wasn't Hawkeye for years and on and on. It is really hard to care about these characters at this point.
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Post by bobc on Jun 21, 2011 12:35:30 GMT -5
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Post by bobc on Jun 19, 2011 16:16:41 GMT -5
I'd love to be wrong. But even if the series continues, will it be as good without this creative team?
Hate being a cynical old man, and would love to be wrong, but...
I am re-reading some of the Beast/Wonderman/Perez/Hellcat issues from back in the day--and those were some great stories. Moondragon was fun to hate.
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Post by bobc on Jun 19, 2011 13:17:51 GMT -5
Unfortunately I think you are right, HB. If the entire "creative team has moved on, " well, what more is there to say?
I bought the DVD's but it took me like an hour to find them in a sea of animated DVD's. I really don't know how you can get anyone's attention with that much competition. Oh well--great while it lasted. If only this had come out ten years ago maybe it would have caught on.
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Post by bobc on Jun 17, 2011 7:56:56 GMT -5
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Post by bobc on Jun 7, 2011 9:29:16 GMT -5
I may have to enroll in Charles's school to get this crap under control! In the meantime, avoid seeing any movies with me.
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Post by bobc on Jun 7, 2011 7:22:15 GMT -5
HB--I can top that theater story, believe it or not. Back in the 80's I went to see some movie with a bunch of friends, and one of the friends was this loud-mouthed, uhhhhh big boned girl named Janet. The movie was bad and we couldn't wait to get out of there. When the lights went up, Janet hurled her large self out of the chair and saw a huge popcorn bucket lying on the floor. For reasons known only to Janet, she decided it would be a good idea to just haul off and kick that bucket with all of her strength! I think she meant for it to fly into the air as a prank, but unfortunately Janet's aim was slightly off. The bucket flew like a bullet, directly into the face of an older lady only 3 feet away. It was like BAM right in the face!!! Janet was mortified-- and ran, and the rest of us couldn't believe what we just witnessed! Humiliated, we all ran! I have no idea what happened to the lady who took the bucket blast to the face, but I do remember her looking rather stunned...
Ahhhh--to be young and obnoxious again...
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Post by bobc on Jun 6, 2011 10:49:52 GMT -5
YES! I think he'd make a great Bruce Banner-but it's too late now!
You know Drew, when I think back on all the X-Men movies, the scene that stands out by far for me is when Sabertooth throws the tree at the truck in that snowstorm. I thought Sabertooth looked really scary! I need to re-watch all of them again to refresh my memory.
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Post by bobc on Jun 6, 2011 8:44:16 GMT -5
Hi Guys--I wouldn't say I disliked it, I just didn't love it the way I loved the other three. I found none of the kids very likable, with the exception of the Beast. I thought Emma Frost and Magneto stole the show, particularly EF.
Of course, what happened to me right before the movie started could have colored my perception. I got there late and it was dark--and I was carrying two hotdogs, a diet Coke, and a bag of popcorn. Can you guess what happened next? BAM! I fell flat on my face, spraying the unfortunate people in the audience with popcorn and diet Coke!! If they weren't paying attention before, they sure were now!!! A guy said "Are you okay?" and I replied "I'm okay, just a little humiliated." I slunk back to the very rear of the theater, trying to avoid the mocking stares of the cruel movie goers! My favorite part was that I wore a plain white t-shirt, and when the lights came up I realized I had a large, attractive diet Coke stain right above my crotch.
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Post by bobc on Jun 5, 2011 16:54:01 GMT -5
HB--I just can't help myself. Haven't seen Thor yet--I tried to see it today after seeing the X-Men, but the next showing of Thor was like 3 hrs later, so I took off.
Gotta say it--just opinion, not a spoiler at all--I was disappointed with the new X-Men movie.
Drew--I was never a big Green Lantern fan so I didn't get the game. I have to say though that the preview for the GL movie looks very impressive.
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Post by bobc on Jun 3, 2011 15:09:48 GMT -5
As long as he doesn't speak jive, I'm cool with it. And as long as he doesn't listen to Gangster Rap.
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Post by bobc on Jun 3, 2011 10:14:24 GMT -5
I always hold back my opinions.
Okay. That was a lie.
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Post by bobc on Jun 2, 2011 7:45:23 GMT -5
Speaking of good comics that have come out lately, and no one was, have you all read that first issues of "Fear Itself" where the hammers appear, and people like Titania become possessed by them? If the first issues are any indication, it's going to be a great series, featuring lots of somewhat forgotten favorite characters! I always liked Titania and The Absorbing Man.
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Post by bobc on Jun 1, 2011 8:39:43 GMT -5
Drew--either I worded my post poorly or you maybe misread it--I love Luke Cage in the Thunderbolts! I think that writer has done a great, great job with the character. The best depiction ever, in my book! I was just referring to when he first appeared--he really spoke like a walking talking black exploitation movie (which I love, by the way). Some of that early dialogue is really cringe-inducing, but then again it was the 70's! I always liked him in the Defenders, especially early on.
And I always loved Monica Rambeau!
Drew I have never understood why people can't discuss issues civilly. I have friends who are all over the board, politically, which is perfectly fine by me--as long as they don't try to bully me or anybody else. I think the main reason so many internet forums have become so nasty is because people are losing the reality that they might get punched in the face if they said some of those things in person.
New X-Men movie in two days!
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Post by bobc on May 30, 2011 9:09:16 GMT -5
HB--right. There are consequences for spouting unpopular opinions and making art that some object to. If I, as a writer, still insist on spouting those opinions, then I will suffer the consequences happily. Everything in life has consequences. Everything in life is about trade offs. Mark Millar took a chance making Nick Fury black--he must have known he'd get some blow back, the only question being how much and from what quarters. He took that risk and that is one of the reasons I really respect him. But having some 3rd party bureaucrat coming in and saying YOU CAN'T DO THAT is completely unacceptable to me. For me, it boils down to giving people as much freedom as possible, and accepting the fact that you live with your own decisions, good bad or indifferent.
Besides--I love hot water.
Drew--no I didn't know they remade Carrie before. I just saw a TV spot on a new version of the 70's original. Weird. I guess Hollywood really IS out of ideas. I am proud of you for questioning your own ideas--I'm the same way. you should never, ever stop learning. The people I don't trust are the ones who have the same opinions at age 45 as they did when they were 16.
HB--I'm not saying I'm staying up all night crying over Heimdall being black in the movie--it really is just a minor issue. Overall, I think Marvel has come a huge way since the 60's in it's portrayal of blacks, with characters like Storm and Captain Marvel. Even Luke Cage, who started out being a walking, talking cliche (whether you like that or not), is today a dynamite character in Thunderbolts. Oh God I can't believe I sued the term dy-no-mite! Hee hee!
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Post by bobc on May 29, 2011 16:56:21 GMT -5
HB--I hear ya, but disagree completely. There have been many, many GREAT "Christian villains"--the first that pops into mind is the Mother in the old movie Carrie--which is being re-made right now from what I understand.If they take out the part where Carrie's mother is a foaming at the mouth religious crazy it will destroy the movie, and I will not spend my money on it. That being said, I am quite vocal on the issue that some anti-religious types have become every bit as obnoxious as the meanest right wing crazies. I work with guys who viciously attack anyone with any kind of religious beliefs and I am reading (right now) a book about Madalyn Murray O'Haire, who considered herself "The Athiest." I don't need to be protected from either side, and being an independent, critical thinker, I can come to my own conclusions.
Anyway--back on topic--Drew, I too would be annoyed with a white or Asian Black Panther mainly because it wouldn't make sense. Wakanda is and always has been a country of indigenous African people. That means black. America has always been mixed, racially, so a black Nick Fury doesn't bother me a bit--except if you want to argue that the change was unnecessary or gratuitous. I think Millar pulled a black Nick Fury off beautifully. Thank GOD he didn't write him as some jive-spouting cliche! The one racial change that did seem gratuitous and unnecessary was making Heimdall black. I mean Thor and his bunch are from Norse mythology, which means white.
Well guys--just to flaunt my moral superiority by preening before you online--I put my money where my big yap is (literally) by buying the EMH on DVD. Can't wait to watch them on the big screen (my large flat screen TV as opposed to my computer monitor. The DVD's were tough to find--they were a tiny spec in a giant sea of animated DVD's. There is sooooooo much competition, no wonder the series in kind of falling between the cracks./
By the way, I had insomnia last night and was rifling through the TV channels--and what did I finally see for the first time? The anime-styled Fantastic Four cartoon AND a Silver Surfer cartoon which I didn't even know came out. Both were absolutely dreadful. I had to turn off the FF cartoon, it was so bad.
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Post by bobc on May 29, 2011 10:50:29 GMT -5
You know, Drew, 30 years ago the prevailing mindset was if you don't like something, turn it off, change the channel. Now we have a whole nation of nannies protecting us lesser beings from ourselves. Comedies are not funny anymore because the only "safe" area these days is bathroom humor, which most of us outgrew in the 4th grade. Sad.
Shir--you bring up a great point. I really, really wish someone would come up with a way to view things online without sacrificing sales or advertising. Why, in the new millennium, do we have to wait until Sunday morning to watch EMH? Why not post the shows online, along with the advertising that you see on TV? I was threatened with a lawsuit when I posted a Don Kirshner's Rock Concert clip on Youtube, despite the fact that I got permission from the band that was featured on that particular episode of DKRC. In fact, they provided me the tape! I am all for protecting copyrights and want artists to be paid for what they produce, but in this case DKRC has been gone for decades, and they have never made any of the lesser known band clips available to the public. Why not? I wish I could purchase whatever I want--but what do you do when it isn't available anywhere? I really wish there was some service where you could buy or rent more obscure movies and TV shows--Net Flicks tends to carry the more mainstream stuff.
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Post by bobc on May 28, 2011 19:23:19 GMT -5
Badger--I don't think any sane person would argue with you. After all, what sells better, a Big Mac or Fillet Mignon? Big Macs of course. But would any sane person say a Big Mac is a better meal?
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Post by bobc on May 28, 2011 8:48:11 GMT -5
Drew--that is infuriating. I am so tired of political correctness. We have somehow, over the past 50 years, allowed the most neurotic crybabies to dictate what can or cannot be seen, read, said, etc. This whole idea that someone, somewhere (if such a person actually exists in the first place) might be offended that a Star of David is used in a game is just sick. You CANNOT write interesting stories if you are shackled by PC bullsmit. You can't be funny, either, if you live in constant fear of offending the most neurotic amongst us. People like Chris Rock and David Chapelle are FUNNY because they are honest and say things other people wouldn't dare. I really, really despise what political correctness is doing to the world of art. Politics should NEVER intrude upon art. I see this in my field all the time. Great, interesting storylines for games being absolutely crippled because layers of corporate hacks, who need to justify their own uselessness while at the same time morally preening in front of those of us who actually create content, who wring their hands over offending a handful of cry babies. What they fail to grasp is that their incessant interference blands out the story, taking it from fascinating to mediocre, and hence nobody buys the game because it is BORING.
I am sorry for the rant, but as an artist, this is a very sore subject for me. It is depressing as hell to me to watch movies from the 70's that were funny, movies like "Airplane," which would never be made today due to political correctness. Remember the scene where Barbra Billingsley talks jive to the two black guys? My black friends ROARED with laughter when they saw that scene, but today self-appointed spokesmen for blacks would have shut that movie down. Remember on "Living Color" the skit "Men on Film" featuring the flaming gay characters? It was hilarious. The gay people I knew would actually stay home on Sunday nights, hoping "Men on Film" would come on. But then I start reading in the press about how that skit might offend gay people, it was stereotypical, all gay men don't act that way, blah blah blah. Meanwhile, gay people LOVED IT.
I work with a twenty something guy who informed me that he refused to watch "King of the Hill" because it was "stereotypical" about Texans. I couldn't believe how stunted the thinking there was. Extremes are FUNNY. What do you have if you take the extremes out of art? How would "King of the Hill" be funny if it didn't highlight some of the absurdities of living in Texas?
ugh. Shir--you are right, the Star of David is an ancient symbol that has meant many things over the centuries. The swastika is another ancient symbol, which meant virility to early pagan Europeans, and it was just that connotation that made the Nazis adopt it. But of course nobody knows about these things, they are ignorant of history, and yet these same ignorant people will disallow artists from using these symbols--imposing their dogmas on creative people.
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