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Post by dlw66 on Mar 15, 2006 14:46:30 GMT -5
With the current marketing given to former lightweights like Ms. Marvel, Luke Cage (I don't mean that in an insulting way -- just surprised at the attention they are getting these days after cancellations of their first runs in the 1970's and being in and out of creative limbo since), etc., does anyone see a return to prominence of Mantis? Those stories circa #112-136 and a couple of GS's in the middle were great fun!!
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Post by bobc on Mar 15, 2006 15:46:29 GMT -5
I hope so. I loved Mantis-she was the Omarosa of the Avengers--a total scheming, back-biting hag, but she sure could perk up a dull storyline! I was hoping Wanda would scratch her eyes out but sadly, we were denied that catfight.
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Post by Shiryu on Mar 16, 2006 12:48:43 GMT -5
She hasn't been around for quite a while, but in these days everything is possible.
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Post by Van Plexico on Mar 16, 2006 20:19:07 GMT -5
Well, since it's Brian Michael Bendis's Marvel Universe now, and everyone else just lives in it, that means we're getting Spider-Woman and other Bendis-favorites back in their own books. If Steve Englehart ever becomes the big muckety muck writer at Marvel, maybe we'll get a Mantis series. But I think the odds of that are just slightly better than the odds of Klaw gaining the Infinity Gauntlet (Infinity SonicClaw?) and making himself master of the world.
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Post by bobc on Mar 17, 2006 10:48:41 GMT -5
Bendis probably thinks Spiderwoman is Mantis. After all they both have large breasts.
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Post by Tana Nile on Oct 24, 2006 16:46:22 GMT -5
I know Mantis appeared in Fantastic Four 324-325, but I don't have those issues and can't seem to find info as to what happened in them. Anyone able to fill me in on the current existence of the Celestial Madonna?
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Post by dlw66 on Oct 24, 2006 18:25:40 GMT -5
The Phantom will -- he's a genius on par with Peter Sanderson and George Olshewski !! Or, he has more time for research than the rest of us (laziness is a concern here -- why should I look it up, because I know he will?).
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Post by The Night Phantom on Oct 24, 2006 22:06:09 GMT -5
The Phantom will -- he's a genius on par with Peter Sanderson and George Olshewski !! Or, he has more time for research than the rest of us (laziness is a concern here -- why should I look it up, because I know he will?). Hmm…I’m tempted to post no answer or an unhelpful one, but I don’t wish to punish Tana for Doug’s oily-tongued sloth. I know Mantis appeared in Fantastic Four 324-325, but I don't have those issues and can't seem to find info as to what happened in them. Anyone able to fill me in on the current existence of the Celestial Madonna? Kang was in those issues, and I don’t remember much beyond that, except that Mantis’ return to space was supposed to be Christmasy, with a bright star in the heavens or some such. Of course, that’s a motif for the Madonna. In Englehart’s Avengers: Celestial Quest limited series (2001–2002), Mantis was shown alive and well and living in space, being a full-time mom to the adolescent Celestial Messiah (Sequoia a.k.a. Quoi) and briefly sharing romance with the Vision. She was seen among the heroes gathered at Avengers Mansion during “Disassembled”, but it’s been established that at least one of those present was actually a doppelgänger created by the Scarlet Witch, and so I can’t be certain Mantis was really there (though I’m not sure why Wanda would bring another Mantis into the world—I guess she really was crazy).
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Post by dlw66 on Oct 24, 2006 22:22:00 GMT -5
Oily-tongued? Oily-tongued?? Well I may be , but you did come up with the answer .
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Post by Shiryu on Oct 25, 2006 4:09:02 GMT -5
I didn't know the doppelganger thing, who was it ?
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Post by The Night Phantom on Oct 25, 2006 5:44:23 GMT -5
I didn't know the doppelganger thing, who was it ? Quicksilver, as revealed in Avengers Finale.
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Post by Doctor Doom on Oct 25, 2006 10:50:00 GMT -5
It's actually very possible, and should be interesting to note!
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Post by Tana Nile on Oct 25, 2006 18:15:09 GMT -5
Thanks for the info. I was unaware that anyone ever revisited Mantis after GS Avengers 4. I will have to fill in those gaps in my collection.
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Post by sharkar on Oct 25, 2006 18:49:14 GMT -5
She was seen among the heroes gathered at Avengers Mansion during “Disassembled”... Yeah, that was a great panel- -the assembled Avengers, shown at the end of #501 and also in the beginning of #502. You couldn't miss Mantis, or her doppelganger. Has it ever been explained how she came about to possess antennae--are these just for effect and part of her "costume", or were these somehow implanted? Calling Dr. Pym!
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ozbot
Reservist Avenger
Posts: 103
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Post by ozbot on Oct 25, 2006 19:09:53 GMT -5
I used to run the Unofficial Handbook of the Marvel Universe site, so I still have some pretty exhaustive files on most Marvel characters. (I'm also helping mod the Marvel Universe site of Marvel.com) Anyway, here's my info on Mantis after she rocketed into space in GS Avengers:
"Several months later, she returned to Earth, giving birth to her son and rearing him in isolation. She named him Sequoia after the noblest of Earth trees, or Quoi for short. After one year, Quoi was taken by the Cotati to live on their planet.
"Mantis then embarked on a tour the galaxy. She encountered and nursed the injuries of the alien Silver Surfer when he was wounded in an encounter with the Elders of Universe. Adventuring with the Surfer, the two fell in love. Together, they stopped a plot by the Elders of the Universe to destroy and recreate the universe in a bid to achieve ultimate power. In retaliation, the Elders presumably killed Mantis in an explosion.
"In actuality, Mantis did not die but had managed to project her essence across the stars, discovering that in becoming the Celestial Madonna, she had become the "essence of life." Nevertheless, her essence had difficulty in re-cohering, manifesting itself in a series of "ghosts" on Earth. The first ghost believed herself to be the true Mantis, albeit slightly amnesiac. She rejoined the Avengers to recover from her amnesia, and in the process revived her true body before taking her leave to return to her child. Another ghost appeared, this time pursued by Kang and seeking vengeance on the Cotati for taking custody of her child. The Fantastic Four helped Mantis repel Kang's attack, and she willed her spirit to leave her body again in order to pursue them and retrieve the child. Yet another ghost appeared to join the Silver Surfer and other heroes in stopping a mad rampage of Galactus, which ultimately led to Galactus' death. Ultimately, however, whenever a Mantis-phantom would leave the presence of others, its presence would fade from their minds and ultimately reality itself. Eventually, Mantis' essence became more substantial, remaining as five separate sides to herself-- outcast, mother, prostitute, priestess, and hero-- although none of the separate selves fully remembered Mantis' true past.
"When a star appeared to announce the maturation of Quoi, the Cosmic Messiah, Thanos sought to destroy Mantis' separate selves before they could be reunited in order that he could then destroy Quoi. Instead, the death of each Mantis would merge its essence with the other until Mantis was fully rejuvenated. Using her renewed cosmic powers, the restored Celestial Madonna was able to thwart Thanos. Mantis elicited help from an assemblage of Avengers and their ally, Haywire, to find Quoi before Thanos.
"Although she was reunited with Quoi, she found him bitter over his mother's long absence and his own feelings of isolation among the Cotati. Mantis also rekindled her romantic relationship with the Vision. Alongside the Avengers, Mantis worked to defeat Thanos's efforts to kill Quoi, and in the process discovered the cosmic Rot, a state of un-being that threatened the existence of Eternity. Thanos and his enemies were forced to work together to destroy the Rot, and ultimately Thanos fled, distraught over his role in creating the Rot in the first place. Mantis and Quoi reconciled after the conflict, and Mantis allowed Quoi to leave to explore the universe and his role within it. Presumably, Mantis returned to Earth with the Avengers, although the Vision broke off any further romantic relationship."
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Post by dlw66 on Oct 25, 2006 19:19:59 GMT -5
Thanks a lot!! That is wonderful information that, past the Silver Surfer adventures, I did not know. Now, I'm not sure I care for all that has gone on, but I do appreciate being filled in.
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ozbot
Reservist Avenger
Posts: 103
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Post by ozbot on Oct 25, 2006 19:23:46 GMT -5
No problem! Now, I'm not sure I care for all that has gone on... Well, just think of them as "ghosts" of the real Mantis. Englehart did!
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Post by The Night Phantom on Oct 25, 2006 20:19:00 GMT -5
The Phantom will -- he's a genius on par with Peter Sanderson and George Olshewski !! Don’t worry—I didn’t want that crown anyway!
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steed
Reservist Avenger
Posts: 215
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Post by steed on Oct 25, 2006 21:05:45 GMT -5
Hey Phantom, stand up and be counted.
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Post by Bored Yesterday on Oct 26, 2006 8:16:09 GMT -5
The history of Mantis is indeed outlandish and hard to follow after GS 4. I think I can barely remember a little bit of that from Silver Surfer comics in the early 90s. Truth be told, I like the character a lot less now than I did before I read about her convulted latter-day existence.
5 selves separated out? Give me a break -- sounds like a writer's notes skipped a step somewhere between the conceptual stage and plot outline.
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ozbot
Reservist Avenger
Posts: 103
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Post by ozbot on Oct 26, 2006 9:19:41 GMT -5
Well, the way I wrote the profile was to reflect what Avengers: Celestial Quest had established. All those "ghost selves" was Englehart's way of retconning all of Mantis' previouis experiences. (i.e., all of her non-Englehart-written appearances). In other words, those weren't originally written as ghost-selves, but Englehart wanted a way to wrap up all these varying accounts. Sorry to cause any confusion.
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Post by bobc on Oct 26, 2006 10:59:53 GMT -5
I felt that Mantis should have disappeared after she became the madonna. I hated when she married that damned tree--that was stupid.
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Post by Bored Yesterday on Oct 26, 2006 11:33:24 GMT -5
I didn't know Englehart came back with a Celestial Quest. He's entitled to make whatever retcons he wants to fix up his character. That's cool and I can dig it. I really ought to look that up, and I didn't mean to disparage the concise summary ozbot cooked up for us. I'm a great admirer of Englehart's original Avengers run.
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Post by Nutcase65 on May 7, 2007 15:01:04 GMT -5
Celestial Quest, which brought us the terribly interesting,... yaaawwwwnnnnn,... Sequoia. and Death and Thanos have a baby,.. how sweet.,.... soooo sleeeeeppy ,... plus the added bonus of ,....more Manti,... snnnooorrrre.
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Post by Engage on May 7, 2007 19:45:11 GMT -5
This one feels that the speech pattern of Mantis is about as awesome as it gets.
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Post by Nutcase65 on May 7, 2007 20:28:01 GMT -5
If Thor and Mantis had a child together, could you imagine what that kid would talk like?
Verily, this one doth pledge this one's troth, that thy effort wilt be in vain.
ouch , my brain
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Post by Crimson Cowl on May 8, 2007 10:45:36 GMT -5
I've never been much of a fan of the Celestial Madonna stories in the Avengers (or of Englehart generally). I don't think Mantis has ever been a very interesting character though I do think she has the potential to be if all the Celestial Madonna stuff were ditched.
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Post by dlw66 on May 8, 2007 12:16:34 GMT -5
I still say it's one of my favorite Avengers storylines. I liked that it included Iron Man and Thor, along with Wanda, Vision, and Hawkeye. I liked the scope of the story, as well as the length (it's a pretty fat trade paperback!), and, although I am not crazy about the resolution, it remains a bright spot from my comics-reading youth.
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Post by Nutcase65 on May 8, 2007 19:39:05 GMT -5
Sequoia as a rotten teenager got on my nerves almosr as much as Mantis.
You don't get to hear me so completely negative as here but as much as DLW likes this story I dislike it.
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Post by dlw66 on May 8, 2007 21:55:32 GMT -5
I have a feeling that my good vibes for this story would be strongly compromised had I read Celestial Quest. Methinks I would do well to stay away and not ruin it for myself, hmmm?
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