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Post by Yellowjacket on Apr 13, 2006 1:41:06 GMT -5
Big John for sure did like drawing, only he wasn´t fond of drawing comics. But he could make a living of it, so who would resent him for that?
And, as we all know, he did give us some fantastic art, so what? He was a great artist and so are his drawings, all the more impressive as comics were merely a job for him.
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Post by fourcolorfigs on Apr 15, 2006 10:36:24 GMT -5
I would have to say:
1. Rob Liefeld 2. George Tuska 3. Al Milgrom (I like his inks, but his pencils were too stiff)
Scott
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Post by Nutcase65 on May 4, 2007 15:37:52 GMT -5
Though I don't believe he's ever worked on the AVENGERS book itself, John Romita, JR drew Iron Man for a while, during the Michelinie-Layton first run, and was great. Then he developed this style he has now, which is "rougher" and makes everyone look as if they're biting their lower lips, pensive. It's really weird, to me. So, as popular as JR JR is, I really, really hope he never gets the AVENGERS gig... He did a few of the Avengers in vol 3. He used that same bizarre style. That phase of his artwork I didn't like even one little bit.
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Post by dlw66 on May 4, 2007 22:21:30 GMT -5
He's brutal. Tries to be too much like the "modern" Frank Miller -- who happens to now be brutal as well.
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Post by sharkar on May 5, 2007 12:50:46 GMT -5
Speaking of Romita Jr., there's a feature on him in the latest issue of Rough Stuff #3, a publication issued by TwoMorrows Publishing. In fact, on Free Comic Book Day (today--May 5th) and continuing for a few days, TwoMorrows are offering free downloads of some of their periodicals: Alter Ego #65: great feature/interview on Nick Cardy, one of the most distinctive DC artists Jack Kirby Collector #47: even though Kirby's art may seem primitive compared to Adams and those who came after, you've got to see the reproductions of his pencils-- exquisite. Also, there's an interesting feature on who may have been the mystery inker on FF#1 and #2...the name given is George Klein, who became Curt Swan's Superman inker. Interesting story of how, when he was ousted from DC in the late 60s, Stan welcomed him back with open arms and told him to "ink like Sinnott." Among other assignments, Klein went on to ink Buscema's Avengers (only about a half-dozen issues; Klein died in 1969). I know many prefer Palmer on Big John, but I've always considered Klein to be the perfect inker for Buscema. Write Now! #14: interview with Bendis. Back Issue #21: Daredevil feature: John Romita Jr., Frank Miller and others Draw! #12: Kyle Baker feature. Rough Stuff #3: in addition to the aforementioned John Romita Jr. feature, a piece on John Buscema. 'Nuff said. I am a steady customer of TwoMorrows (and dlw, I know you are too) but for those who aren't familiar with their magazines, this is the perfect opportunity to see what you're missing! twomorrows.com/
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Post by Engage on May 5, 2007 12:59:37 GMT -5
I have to say that there's no way Liefield could be considered the worst Avengers artist. Even if the characters looked like aliens you could generally tell what was happening. I think his art was better than pretty much everything that had come between The Gathering and The Crossing, because I just couldn't figure out what was supposed to be happening.
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Post by dlw66 on May 5, 2007 17:20:18 GMT -5
I have to say that there's no way Liefield could be considered the worst Avengers artist. Yeah, it would be a shame to just pigeonhole him as the worst Avengers artist; he has that distinction for the New Mutants, X-Force, and some Image crap, too.
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Post by Nutcase65 on May 6, 2007 14:23:54 GMT -5
I have to say that there's no way Liefield could be considered the worst Avengers artist. Yeah, it would be a shame to just pigeonhole him as the worst Avengers artist; he has that distinction for the New Mutants, X-Force, and some Image crap, too. also some Hallmark greeting cards that sucked as well.
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Post by dlw66 on May 6, 2007 18:44:02 GMT -5
You are NOT serious, are you? I'm so out of the loop sometimes that you may very well be telling the truth.
Are you?
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Post by Nutcase65 on May 6, 2007 20:08:01 GMT -5
You are NOT serious, are you? I'm so out of the loop sometimes that you may very well be telling the truth. Are you? Man DLW,... it is ME we're talking about here. ;D We all know that I would never ever joke or be sarcastic. Hallmark couldn't let him do a card for them their motto is "When you care enough to send the BEST"
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Post by The Night Phantom on May 7, 2007 19:31:55 GMT -5
Hallmark couldn't let him do a card for them their motto is "When you care enough to send the BEST" You’re two syllables off. “When you care enough to send the scary chest.”
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Post by Alchemist-X on May 30, 2007 17:46:48 GMT -5
Hallmark couldn't let him do a card for them their motto is "When you care enough to send the BEST" You’re two syllables off. “When you care enough to send the scary chest.” Exhalt!!!!! And while Leifeld is lackluster overall, in a sort of odd, way the Avengers were a team more fiting to his style so its hard to say worst Avengers artist ever (Still beter than Lenil Yu's work afterall) But artists new and Old who don't do the Avengers any kind of justice would include Leifeld, Lenil Yu, and Al Milgrom.
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Post by redstatecap on May 31, 2007 1:13:39 GMT -5
I think some artists try too strenuously to be "edgy" or "different," so much that it hurts their potential. I mean, it seems to me from looking at Yu's work that he could be a more...what's the word...conventional artist, but that certain features of his work are an affectation. The uber-scratchiness, the strange profile shots, and so forth. I speculate that if he wasn't so concerned with aggresively differentiating himself, he would be a better artist for it. Liefeld, I don't know. If I had as many nasty things said about my art over the years I would not rest until my art improved. I give him credit for toning down the more ridiculous features, but generally speaking his art looks just about as bad as it ever did.
RSC
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Post by spiderwasp on Jul 17, 2007 13:48:51 GMT -5
Okay, I know this isn't technically an Avengers title, but the worst art I have ever seen in a comic was by Thomas Tenney in Force Works. It was possibly even worse than some of the old issues of New Mutants or the fairly recent Human Torch series.
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Post by Doctor Bong on Jul 17, 2007 15:26:04 GMT -5
Okay, I know this isn't technically an Avengers title, but the worst art I have ever seen in a comic was by Thomas Tenney in Force Works. It was possibly even worse than some of the old issues of New Mutants or the fairly recent Human Torch series. I agree wholeheartedly...
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Hourman
Probationary Avenger
Posts: 83
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Post by Hourman on Jul 20, 2007 12:46:46 GMT -5
Some names from the past:
Bob Brown Al Milgrom Gene Colan (good with Daredevil, terrible with the Avengers) Don Heck (in his later runs on the Avengers (i.e. 108, where the fight scenes consist of a panel of Iron Man's back and three splotches to represent punches, or a flash of light with profile shots of a couple of Avengers to represent something disappearing) Those guys who used to pencil all of those "fill-in" issues when the regular artist was trying to catch up (i.e. Avengers 179-180; 145-149...)
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Post by dlw66 on Jul 20, 2007 19:14:21 GMT -5
Just to make a slight correction: issues #145-46 were pencilled by Heck, but #147-49 was the conclusion of the Serpent Crown Affair and was pencilled by the young but talent-budding George Perez. The Thor vs. Orka cover to #149 was very eye-catching to this then-10-year old!!
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Hourman
Probationary Avenger
Posts: 83
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Post by Hourman on Aug 1, 2007 15:13:21 GMT -5
Sorry... glad you caught the error...
Been reliving the early 1970s issues of the Avengers recently. Specifically the issues when Hawkeye became Goliath.
#149 featuring Thor vs. Orca was a great cover... But the cover that really grabbed me was #161, with a rather buxom Scarlet Witch covered in ants...
That's what stuck in this (then) 10-year-old's mind, LOL!
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Post by dlw66 on Aug 1, 2007 19:00:53 GMT -5
One of the best covers of the era, yes!
Hourman, do you have the DVD-ROM? I have been reading at approximately the same period as you lately!
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Hourman
Probationary Avenger
Posts: 83
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Post by Hourman on Aug 2, 2007 10:16:58 GMT -5
No, I've been reading the original paper copies, LOL!
I wasn't even aware of the DVD-ROMs... I've flipped through the Essential Avengers collections to fill in holes, but my runs from about #59-on are pretty complete...
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Post by dlw66 on Aug 2, 2007 20:29:58 GMT -5
Some like the DVD-ROMs, others loathe the thought of reading comics from a screen. However, keep in mind that for around $40, you get about 500 comics plus annuals -- every issue complete cover-to-cover. Head over to the "Avengers ROM" thread and check out some of the thoughts over the past many months.
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Post by The Night Phantom on Aug 2, 2007 21:23:15 GMT -5
Some like the DVD-ROMs, others loathe the thought of reading comics from a screen. Generally I don’t care for reading comics on-screen (maybe I need a bigger screen!). But I find the CD- and DVD-ROMs helpful for research.
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Post by Tana Nile on Aug 3, 2007 10:45:18 GMT -5
Some like the DVD-ROMs, others loathe the thought of reading comics from a screen. Generally I don’t care for reading comics on-screen (maybe I need a bigger screen!). But I find the CD- and DVD-ROMs helpful for research. When I got my new laptop with the 17" screen, it really helped. ;D But there are still some books that have such tiny print that I have to constantly manipulate the page size to read them.
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Post by dlw66 on Aug 4, 2007 9:50:01 GMT -5
Maybe you're just getting old...
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Post by Tana Nile on Aug 4, 2007 16:31:35 GMT -5
Maybe you're just getting old... HEY!! Although I must admit, the last time I saw my eye doctor, he said I now have "menu syndrome" - you know, that problem where you wind up having to hold the menu two feet away from you to read it?! ;D
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Post by Van Plexico on Aug 6, 2007 1:49:46 GMT -5
I read THE MAN WHO STOLE TOMORROW when it first came out, and here's the funny thing about it, for me:
I came along to the AVENGERS with #162, which was a bit after Kang was "definitively" killed, at least for a long while, in #143. So I missed seeing him there. He didn't show up again for quite some time-- several years. And I had no access to back issues when I grew up (rural Alabama in the mid-1970s).
So for a very long time, the ONLY time I'd ever read a Kang story was that book. And yeah, he's totally insane in it. So I thought of Kang as just this totally nutso guy, for years and years.
It was quite surprising to finally read a new Kang story and see him portrayed as an actual intelligent villain and not just a lunatic.
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dave74
Force Works-er
Posts: 21
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Post by dave74 on Dec 14, 2007 17:17:25 GMT -5
I know these two guys rarely if ever worked on the Avengers, but I want to solicit opinions anyway -- Gil Kane and Steve Ditko. Any feelings? I loved Gil Kane's work in the early Captain Marvel series. Don Heck was a good classic artist, but I do have to agree with you that his talent waned quickly. Steve Ditko. . . . classic Dr. Strange stuff, but I don't remember him as an Avenger artist. Hmmmmm.
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Post by ultron69 on May 6, 2009 13:27:06 GMT -5
Infantino is the worst Avengers artist, IMO, even though he only did 4 Avengers issues. Funny that people have mentioned a Beast/Wonder Man #203 Infantino issue, but I am currently reading #178, which is a Beast solo Infantino issue. George Tuska is #2 for me, and Don Heck is probably #3.
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Post by bobc on May 6, 2009 13:37:40 GMT -5
Yeah Infantino sucked. He was like a D-list Gene Colan. I also really, really hated George Tuska as well--God those endless up-the-nose shots and stilted poses just drove me nuts. Blech. I hated Don Heck as well, although these days I have a soft spot for him in hindsight. His work, and Bob Brown's, always seemed really sketchy and lazy to me. To be fair though, Coming off John Buscema's stellar 60's and early 70's work, it would have been almost impossible for anybody to measure up.
Speaking of Gene Colan, I loved his work on Tomb of Dracula and other places, but his issue or two of the Avengers didn't seem to work for me. Just wasn't the right fit, which is cool.
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Post by ultron69 on May 6, 2009 14:53:31 GMT -5
I am just glad that Steve Ditko never drew the Avengers!
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