steed
Reservist Avenger
Posts: 215
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Post by steed on Aug 30, 2006 11:19:33 GMT -5
I never see anything new posted here. Where are all the T-Bolt fans? I never counted myself as one but I picked up the latest issue (#105 I think) and I realy liked it. Lots of cool little things going on and a neat confrontation between Cap and Zemo.
Plus I love the clean crisp look of Tom Grummets art.
Pick it up and tell me what you think.
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Post by dlw66 on Aug 30, 2006 11:23:25 GMT -5
I don't read it, but I have admired Grummet's art. Just good superhero artwork.
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steed
Reservist Avenger
Posts: 215
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Post by steed on Aug 30, 2006 12:25:35 GMT -5
I like Grummet's art too but other than the T-Bolts, what Marvel book would you put him on? I remember he did a run on the FF but what else has he done for Marvel?
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Post by dlw66 on Aug 30, 2006 12:35:17 GMT -5
Don't know. Not sure he's had a major solo or group book. Has he done some DC, because to be honest I really can't place the last time I saw his work...
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Post by The Night Phantom on Aug 31, 2006 16:55:27 GMT -5
I’ve been reading Thunderbolts. I usually just don’t say anything about it. For my money, T’bolts has been the most thoroughly enjoyable of the Civil War crossovers. The stories, as usual, have various plot threads weaving in and out—that’s one of the main attractions of the series for me, really. I also like the current issues’ flirtation with going cosmic, between Zemo’s recent upgrade and the return of the Grandmaster. And of course, there are about a zillion villains.
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Post by jballew on Sept 11, 2006 13:23:32 GMT -5
This has been one of the best plotted and dialogued books that Marvel has these days. To take a cast of misfits and turn them into characters that the readers care about is simply great!
And Fabian has been able to recapture the feeling with the restart. I was furious to see the Radioactive Man on the cover of the first issue as I felt that there was no way he could be included in a believable manner and yet, sure enough, he was.
The character twists and the fact that the plot actually develops each issue is a refreshing change from the current Bendis trends in the rest of Marvel.
All in all, probably my favorite Marvel title at the moment. I just wish that Moonstone/Meteorite would return. Maybe that's going to happen at the end of this arc with the Grandmaster!
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Post by The Night Phantom on Sept 11, 2006 17:37:22 GMT -5
Great first post, J!
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silvermoth
Force Works-er
The War is Over!!
Posts: 25
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Post by silvermoth on Apr 8, 2007 18:28:58 GMT -5
Im reading the new series with Warren Ellis and Mike Deodata. Wonderful stuff
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Post by The Night Phantom on Apr 8, 2007 19:46:09 GMT -5
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Post by Nutcase65 on Apr 8, 2007 20:16:31 GMT -5
I'm still with it, but I'm watching to see what it's gonna do. If it keeps doing the same thing repeatedly I'll save som money there.
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Post by balok on Apr 8, 2007 20:25:56 GMT -5
Im reading the new series with Warren Ellis and Mike Deodata. Wonderful stuff We hold exactly opposite opinions. I dropped it *because* of the new direction, which I found unwholesome and unenjoyable.
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Post by The Night Phantom on Apr 8, 2007 20:50:41 GMT -5
Im reading the new series with Warren Ellis and Mike Deodata. Wonderful stuff We hold exactly opposite opinions. But you’re cousins—identical cousins all the way! One pair of matching bookends, different as night and day!
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Post by Doctor Doom on Apr 9, 2007 17:17:30 GMT -5
See for me, I would never have tired it if not for the CW tie-in. Then I tried it for that and enjoyed it but wasn't sure I had the financial resources to keep it up. Then I read Civil War 4 and realised I was about to be picking this title up, like it or not. Fortunate for me then that it's among my favourite titles on the market.
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BigDuke
Reservist Avenger
Posts: 136
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Post by BigDuke on Apr 11, 2007 8:06:24 GMT -5
I started reading this because of Civil War and the Zemo angle (I have always been a big Cap fan). I really liked the book and the story was engaging. I am waiting to see where this arc takes the book. It does not look promising. The "old" Tbolts had been had and were trying to be good. These Tbolts ARE bad and want to be worse.
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Post by balok on Apr 11, 2007 12:37:34 GMT -5
The "old" Tbolts had been had and were trying to be good. These Tbolts ARE bad and want to be worse. Exactly. This book is about how nasty people can be and still get away with it legally. And, since the CSA doesn't seem to be too concerned with morality, it appears they'll be getting away with a lot for the foreseeable future. And those kinds of stories hold no appeal for me.
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Post by Nutcase65 on Apr 11, 2007 14:40:20 GMT -5
The "old" Tbolts had been had and were trying to be good. These Tbolts ARE bad and want to be worse. Exactly. This book is about how nasty people can be and still get away with it legally. And, since the CSA doesn't seem to be too concerned with morality, it appears they'll be getting away with a lot for the foreseeable future. And those kinds of stories hold no appeal for me. but I think that part of the story will still see singbird and possibly radioactive man trying for redemption, surrounded by evil.
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Post by balok on Apr 11, 2007 14:49:45 GMT -5
but I think that part of the story will still see singbird and possibly radioactive man trying for redemption, surrounded by evil. Perhaps. But Radioactive Man had a chance, when Moonstone ordered him to explode people's cars to make it look like Jack Flag was dangerous. He could have said, "No. That's wrong." Granted, he's from a country where citizens are conditioned to take orders from the government, but he's been here long enough to at least ask questions about such things. So I'm not sure whether he really wants redemption. That leaves Songbird, and while she's an interesting character, she's not enough to carry the book. If I bought T-Bolts, it would be in anticipation of them biting off more than they can chew, and getting slaughtered (perhaps literally) by some opponent. And who wants to pay for a book where you root against the stars?
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Post by Nutcase65 on Apr 11, 2007 15:12:40 GMT -5
What I really think is going to happen is this. I think when Zemo returns from HIS book he's gonna want some answers about what's going on with HIS team. Think about it. He died a hero in the eyes of the people of THE ENTIRD WORLD. He really looks like he's shaping up to be a good guy in his mini. A possibility. Zemo gets the real T-Bolts together, in some form, and comes after the new team, or possibly Osborne. Moonstone will be torn, because she actually has, what for he amounts to, feelings for Zemo. Not saying it is going to happen, but it could be possible. Or in a few months people will be coming to this thread and reminding me that I can't predict the future.
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Post by Doctor Bong on Apr 12, 2007 12:29:43 GMT -5
If you CAN predict the future, please tell when the Sinister Two are going to leave Marvel...
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Post by Doctor Doom on Apr 12, 2007 12:33:58 GMT -5
And who are the "Sinister Two"?
I mean let's see
We have Joe Q and Bendis, the obvious ones. But you don't like Millar. And Ralph Macchio, Tom Brevoort, Molly Lazer and Alex Alonso are big fans of Joe Q. Then there's JMS and Jeph Loeb, big name writers brought in by Joe Q... well, we have Steve McNiven, Frank Cho, Lenil Yu, David Finch, all of whom have expressed admiration for Bendis in the past.... hmm, Ed Brubaker was a big part of the civil war meeting and behind the latest move that you hated so he's out... then we have Greg Pak, Peter David and Dan Slott, three big architects of Marvel's newest crossover... but since it's the Joe Q marvel you obviously want them gone too... Warren Ellis and Mike Deadoto Jr are obvious from this thread... then there's Matt Fraction, he's a big pal of Brubaker's so he has to go...
So basicalkly you want all of Marvel out in wsome way or another.
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Post by Doctor Bong on Apr 12, 2007 12:53:27 GMT -5
No, just those 2... I actually like many of the people you mentioned... Brevoort I'm not crazy about, but I can live with... Now, Doom: I agrre you cannot go around imagining everything these people say are lies or part of a sinister plot but, by the same token, JUST BECAUSE THEY SAY SOMETHING POSITIVE, lets say, about Quesada or Bendis, I don't necessarily aassume it's what they truly feel, after all, these guys work for Quesada & pretty much any quotation by them gets widely publicized at the trade magazines & the net... Do you acknowledge such possibility on certain cases....?
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Post by Doctor Doom on Apr 12, 2007 14:29:36 GMT -5
Why does Bendis have to leave Marvel? I mean, Joey Q I can understand since he's the EiC and thus if he were to leave there'd be a radical policy reshift (although mind you I notice the EiC gets the blame for failures but NEVER gets the credit for successes). But why Bendis? Because everything he ever writes is horrible? Why can't he keep writing USM, a book with a large fanbase and huge critical acclaim and virtually no haters? Because you don't like his New Avengers work?
I'm still amazed you cite Bendis and not Millar. Millar unquestionably is one of Joe Q's biggest devotees, he's already said he'll never write a DC book again while Joe Q is EiC because they're too close, even after his contract expires next year.
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Post by Nutcase65 on Apr 12, 2007 15:38:38 GMT -5
OOOOOhhhhhh Crap!!!!
Doom made sense to me there. This Marvel staff stuff is usuakky above my head, but I think he is right about Millar.
Is it just that Bendis is a more convenient target? Or is it that he has ninjas at Dooms house threatening him as he types?
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Post by balok on Apr 12, 2007 16:07:06 GMT -5
Why does Bendis have to leave Marvel? ... Because everything he ever writes is horrible? Not everything he writes is horrible, but enough of it is that Marvel would be stronger without him than with him. Additionally (and I already know you don't agree), I fear he wields inordinate influence, and affects books he has little to do with. Bendis' work on New hasn't been good since about issue 6, his work on Mighty (so far) is adequate but no better than that. USM is a book I've never read, it might be good or it might not - but he could write it as a contractor if you like - as long as he's not around Marvel and has no influence over editorial policy and no presence at the retreats. But the second of MY pair would be Millar, who doesn't seem to understand the characters he writes or America very well. He needs to be gone yesterday. Again, he did some good work in his own playpen (the Ultimates), but he is not the right guy for 616 - he's flarked it up bad.
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Post by Doctor Bong on Apr 12, 2007 16:30:37 GMT -5
Well, Doom, obviously, Bendis doesn't have to, nor does it looks likely that he will any time soon... I'm just once again venting & expressing my innermost desires... Reallistically, though, IMO, he's so influential at Marvel that, if he remains at all, he would never limit himself to Ultimate stuff (if he would, I would have no problem at all with him, as I don't read those books & I don't HATE the man, I just hate how he writes the characters I care about...). Now, in the case of Millar, I hated CW as well, but that's all (as far as I can recall) that I haven't liked by him.... so that's the reason I haven't nearly as strong feelings for him as a writer as Bendis... BMB, meanwhile, I followed him for years on NA & other related books and despised just about everything about what I saw in those: the style and the content... That's why I'm a lot more lenient with Millar than I am with Bendis... Now, I confess I did like Bendis in Alias & the Pulse and, like many, I'm convinced that this was because those books were totally different animals from Avengers.
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Post by balok on Apr 12, 2007 16:43:22 GMT -5
Yes, Bendis did good work in Alias.
He's clearly a journeyman doing the work of a master. Whether he'll one day actually be a master, I don't know. But he's not there yet.
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Post by Doctor Doom on Apr 12, 2007 16:56:01 GMT -5
But see Balok, I fear you've failed to make a case. Let's review:
-Avengers fans as a group dislike his work on New Avengers rather intensely. So minus one for Bendis.
-Daredevil fans as a group ADORE the work he did there. I'm serious, many Daredevil fans will tell you he's the best thing since Miller. So plus one for Bendis
-USM, as I said, has been critically adored- it faded for a while, but then bounced back. So plus one for Bendis
-Alias and The Pulse, again critically adored and ordered by fans. Plus one.
So basically Balok, you feel that because he hasn't written good Avengers stories, he's not good enough to stay as a writer at Marvel? That's ridiculous! Kurt Busiek has written poor Superman stories, does that automatically make him a bad writer and invalidate all his good Marvel work? Jurgens wrote a poor Cap run, do we suddenly say his entire Thor run was hideous because of it? I didn't like JrJr on Thor, so does this mean he should never ever draw a Marvel book again? You're using one book you're a fan of and using it to judge a writer, ignoring his other work... in a genre, this "noir, low-key, less hero" genre, he is the almost undisputed master of! -Powers- adored by fans. Plus one.
Bong, you lost me the second you said "Realistically" and then went on about Bendis' control of Marvel, hich is still the worst comic fanbase myth I have ever heard. I actually prefer the "Marvel are using the New Coke solution and putting out loads of bad stories so they can put out better ones in a year and they'll lookl better by comparison!" theory to this "Bendis is the puppetmaster!" one.
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Post by Nutcase65 on Apr 12, 2007 17:46:54 GMT -5
For those who are anti Bendis, do you see any hope for his redemption, or do you think that ego is an issue here?
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Post by Alchemist-X on Apr 12, 2007 18:20:41 GMT -5
But see Balok, I fear you've failed to make a case. Let's review: -Avengers fans as a group dislike his work on New Avengers rather intensely. So minus one for Bendis. -Daredevil fans as a group ADORE the work he did there. I'm serious, many Daredevil fans will tell you he's the best thing since Miller. So plus one for Bendis -USM, as I said, has been critically adored- it faded for a while, but then bounced back. So plus one for Bendis -Alias and The Pulse, again critically adored and ordered by fans. Plus one. So basically Balok, you feel that because he hasn't written good Avengers stories, he's not good enough to stay as a writer at Marvel? That's ridiculous! Kurt Busiek has written poor Superman stories, does that automatically make him a bad writer and invalidate all his good Marvel work? Jurgens wrote a poor Cap run, do we suddenly say his entire Thor run was hideous because of it? I didn't like JrJr on Thor, so does this mean he should never ever draw a Marvel book again? You're using one book you're a fan of and using it to judge a writer, ignoring his other work... in a genre, this "noir, low-key, less hero" genre, he is the almost undisputed master of! -Powers- adored by fans. Plus one. Bong, you lost me the second you said "Realistically" and then went on about Bendis' control of Marvel, hich is still the worst comic fanbase myth I have ever heard. I actually prefer the "Marvel are using the New Coke solution and putting out loads of bad stories so they can put out better ones in a year and they'll lookl better by comparison!" theory to this "Bendis is the puppetmaster!" one. You forgot to minus one for is work on Mighty Avengers (Assuming we're saying thats bad, I personally will reserve judgement for later) But even then, its obvious the good outweights the bad.
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Post by Nutcase65 on Apr 12, 2007 18:41:21 GMT -5
I don't think many of us are going to write it off as bad for at least one more issue.
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