Anyone catch the "Comic-Con Quest " episode from the Hollywood Treasures show, on SyFy last Wednesday? I didn't, but friends let me know that the episode included the show's producer Joe Maddalena showing Stan the original artwork from Fantastic Four #12. So I went to SyFy's site and here's the link to the episode. The FF #12 shows up circa 4:54, Stan shows up around 7:00. IMO it's fascinating.
Oh great --I see the extended version has been removed and does not seem not to be available online anymore--not just at this link but at other sites too.
In the extended version, Stan is seen looking over several pages of the original art for FF #12 and he asks over and over again why there are no Kirby-written notes in the page margins--there are only notes from Stan--and did someone erase the Kirby notes, etc. Lots of "Jack was the best", "Jack was heavily involved" pronouncements from Stan.
So I guess this footage was removed from the internet because of ongoing (and future) litigation (Stan, Stan Lee Media, Marvel/Disney, Kirby Estate, and so on) over who created what characters/stories (read: $$$ profits).
I watched the extended version just in time before it was deleted, but unfortunately not in time to download it. It was indeed really interesting, Stan wasn't really surprised at seeing original artwork per se, but at seeing his original notes (some of which he couldn't read anymore because they had faded). What he said about Jack's notes and them having been erased was also fascinating, as it was the fact that he could remember Jack's writing after all these years. I hope someone managed to download the video in time and it resurfaces again.
What he said about Jack's notes and them having been erased was also fascinating...
I don't expect a nearly 88-year old person (Stan) to remember or know minutiae like exact dates, but the reason there were no Kirby notations on FF #12 is because Kirby didn't write margin notes on that issue, which was published in late 1962 (with a cover date of March 1963). This was before Kirby started using margin notes (on Marvel's superhero comics).
As any Kirby historian (yes, the very ones whom Stan derides in this video ) could tell Stan, it's been established that at Marvel, Kirby started to write margin notes sometime in 1964 when he began to do layouts for other pencilers to work over (such as Heck, on the Avengers). These margin notes functioned as Kirby's instructions/help to the penciler.
But Kirby also wrote notes in the books he did full pencils for, FF and Thor. Again, Kirby historians place this practice as starting in 1964 (some of the earliest documented instances are FF Ann. #2/Journey Into Mystery #111). As Stan the editor became busier with the growing number of titles, Jack necessarily started taking on much more of the FF's plotting (also Thor/Tales of Asgard) and started leaving margin notes letting Stan know what was going on in the stories. But this was not necessary in 1962/3, since Marvel had a relatively small and still manageable output so Stan was still able to plot/script the FF.
So, in the program, Stan wondering who erased the Kirby notes is technically inaccurate for this particular comic (and would easily be disproved). But by mentioning it over and over again, IMO Stan underscored and reinforced the notion that Kirby was heavily involved in general. As mentioned I guess that scared certain people and may be partly why the extended video was removed from online circulation.
I also wonder how this collector managed to get a complete set of FF #12's original art; I know it was mentioned the art was assembled from "various" sources, but I'm amazed that all of the pages were found! I wonder if Dick Ayers (the inker, and still alive) knows that these pages are around?
Last Edit: Nov 16, 2010 17:50:54 GMT -5 by sharkar