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Post by spiderwasp on Aug 29, 2010 14:16:24 GMT -5
It seems like we hardly even mention the FF around here and I was just wondering if anyone other than me even reads their book. I may not be for much longer.
The problem I have with the FF is that it doesn't seem to have any focus. I have no idea what I might be getting when I pick up a book. One issue will have a good old fashioned, character-driven story with a classic villain and be easy to follow. Then we go right back to yet another complicated story about time travel and alternate versions of everybody that, quite frankly, I can't even begin to follow. Of course, part of the problem is that I don't care enough about this stories to really even try. Why do the writers keep thinking there is some kind of emotional punch attached to seeing terrible things happen to alternate versions of beloved characters that have no real impact on the current version of the character.
I've about how it with the inconsistency of the title and probably won't continue to buy it on a regular basis (I've quit it many times before anyway.) I was just wondering what other people's thoughts were.
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Post by owene on Aug 29, 2010 15:54:32 GMT -5
I'm reading it, was just about to post about it in fact,
I was really blown away by Hickman's first tpb, while in retrospect I think some of that was that it was the first new super hero stuff I'd read in 9 years I really enjoyed how he seemed to have incorporated the sort of ideas that used to take place in Astro City or Moore's supreme run in a main MU book. It seemed like a anything could happen 'what if' riff on the classic feel of the FF but in the book itself.
Having stuck with it and having gotten more up to speed with modern Marvel the gloss is wearing off a little. I love how he writes the characters and I think his plot ideas really work but I think he is possibly just throwing too many things in and not really giving them space to breathe.
Thats unfortunate as I think having the FF as the source of sci fi ideas in the MU really works but, and it seems unusual to say this about a current book, he could do with taking two or three issues over each idea. As you say you can't quite connect and each issue is over before you've got to grips with whats there.
He is also very quick to rewrite stuff in quite a throwaway way, the latest issue has a college age Reed, Ben and Doom facing Kang's Anachronauts who an alternate nathaniel Richards claims to have stolen from one of the many alternate selves he has killed. I know there have been links between Kang and NR in the past from other writers but it seems a really big development to toss away in an inserted flashback when there are so many other plots going on
It's a pity because I think Hickman really does have the voices and concepts down brilliantly well and as a Kirby FF nut I should really like the idea of a rush of single issue 'here's all my ideas see what sticks' stories but i think if he slowed down slightly it would be even better
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Post by bobc on Aug 30, 2010 9:26:24 GMT -5
I haven't been reading FF these days--picked up a couple of issues over the past year or so and just never got interested. To me, the FF is at it's best when there are lots of guest stars. AND they have possibly the greatest array of super villains in comics, which was shown in considerable splendor in issue #100. For me to buy the FF, I'd wanna see She Hulk and Tigra stopping in for a few issues, Medusa, people like that.
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Post by humanbelly on Aug 30, 2010 15:51:51 GMT -5
Y'know, my FF subscription has been running continuously since-- wow-- like 1980, and my collection runs quite deep well before then. But I have to confess that it's been years and years since I've been able to say that I've really been following & looking forward to it. Probably the arc 'way back that had the Trapster going into the Negative Zone, and we discovered that Annihilus sort of gets re-born whenever he dies, and there were Pilgrims. . . (really, it was good!). The team is too often re-booted or re-imagined or "taking a bold new direction" at the hands of too-often shifting creative teams. In fact, I feel like that's almost become the book's identity, as I think that trend can be safely traced clear back to the period when Reed was "really, truly, we-mean-it-this-time, no foolin', cross our hearts" killed by Doctor Doom. About 12 years ago or so? Maybe 15? There was the whole Pier 4 experiment which just evaporated. There was Teen Franklin. There was the whole thing with alternate-universe teen Valeria, and then a cosmic being who just changed the entire continuity to what she apparently "felt" it should be like. Reed took over Latveria & was Doom for awhile. . . which was somehow all forgiven. I think the horrible lack of continuity in writing Reed is what's turned me off the most. There seems to be no editorial oversight on how he's treated by different writers. He's been stalwart, staunch, and strong. He's been a raving, panic-stricken nutcase. He's been an achingly warm-hearted father & husband. He's been a clue-free scientist with no grasp at all of how to communicate with his loved ones. He's been a man who would under no circumstance compromise his moral stance (kind of like Cap). He's the guy who cold-bloodedly created and supported a super-gulag in the Negative Zone. This isn't a complex character, this is simply inconsistent writing over the course of time.
And the stories have indeed been too big. . . too broad in scope. . . with whole universes and realities regularly at stake. . . and there have been too many of them. (Although I am forced to admit that I haven't been reading them regularly. "Alternate Future Old Sue Saga" lost me completely, and "Multiple Timeline Reed Club", although artistically kinda neat, was noticeably weak in both plot & script, IMO. I didn't buy into it at all.)
Hmm. You know what? Civil War, Illuminati, and Hulk-napping aside, the FF as a regular title doesn't actually seem all that directly involved in the Marvel Universe anymore. Maybe that's the problem? They're not out there fightin' our fight, they're fightin' for the noble cause of oppressed planet Deltoid 6 or the Mushroom Dimension or something. . .
It would be great to see them tackle a more contemporary, traditional, local adversary, I think.
Wow-- SW, you got me goin', didn't you? "Let's watch HB talk his fool head off AGAIN! It'll be great!" Geeze, I fall for it every time. . .
HB
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Post by bobc on Aug 30, 2010 17:14:30 GMT -5
You know HB, if someone asked me (off the top of my head) when the most exciting time for the FF was, I would say the period when Sue left Reed back in the mid 70's. I loved how the Frightful Four ambushed the Thing, loved how Medusa rescued him, loved the introduction of a powerful new female villain (Thundra--back when there were no super-strong females), loved how Sue fought the FRFR by herself, and loved the fight between her and Reed which resulted in her leaving him. Top notch art by John B and Tom P, and great writing.
I agree about the endless rebooting, the endless alternate realities (zzzzzzz), and the fact that too many Next Big Events get really tiresome. I also agree that the FF has become too isolated--they used to be the cornerstone of the Marvel Universe. I was really happy to see them fight alongside Namor and Black Panther in Doom War.
Sue became way more interesting when her powers improved dramatically. Nothing was more boring than watching her cowering behind an ever-fragile, about-to-shatter force field. When she began using her force field as an offensive weapon was when Sue really came into her own. Sue's ability to turn things invisible is a VERY powerful weapon, too, if you think about it. Why hasn't she ever made someone's weapon disappear, fooling them into thinking it was really gone? Why has she not caused any bad guys to slam into a wall she's made vanish (okay, she did this one time with Doc Doom)? Why hasn't she effected an ambush by turning her team-mates invisible for a surprise attack? Made someone's clothes vanish so that the embarrassment would render him ineffectual?
Writers also need to make the Torch's powers more interesting. He is capable of drawing heat OUT of the air, as Ice Man does, but this has only been shown once that I can recall. He should develop those abilities.
Howzabout Reed? A good writer could make his powers way more interesting. Why have they never evolved? If he can become super pliable, why can't he become super hard as well? The Sandman can!
But most of all, bring back the FRFR, Annilhus, Mole Man, Molecule Man, The Hulk, Sub Mariner, ect.
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Post by sharkar on Sept 1, 2010 11:45:42 GMT -5
For me to buy the FF, I'd wanna see She Hulk and Tigra stopping in for a few issues, Medusa, people like that. I hear you, bob--"People like that" are exactly why I bought this, FF #577...the only FF issue I've bought in--well, many a moon! (Great Alan Davis cover. Story was so-so.) [/quote]
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Post by starfoxxx on Sept 1, 2010 14:44:04 GMT -5
I picked up a recent FF issue out of curiosity, and because it had Impossible Man on the cover, but the Impossible Man/Arcade story was pretty boring, seemed rushed, and was just not funny. Then the second half was pretty lame, too. I admit, what made the FF differnt was the "family" aspect---but since Franklin (and now Valeria) have taken bigger roles in the plotlines--- I dunno, it just doesn't interest me at all. I just never have been a Franklin fan since he began to talk. Anyhoo, I think i wasted 3 bucks.
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Post by humanbelly on Sept 1, 2010 15:18:27 GMT -5
You know HB, if someone asked me (off the top of my head) when the most exciting time for the FF was, I would say the period when Sue left Reed back in the mid 70's. I loved how the Frightful Four ambushed the Thing, loved how Medusa rescued him, loved the introduction of a powerful new female villain (Thundra--back when there were no super-strong females), loved how Sue fought the FRFR by herself, and loved the fight between her and Reed which resulted in her leaving him. Top notch art by John B and Tom P, and great writing. Yes, that was an extremely gut-wrenching and memorable arc, bobc. I'm right there with ya. My initial influx of FF issues when I began collecting was centered right around that time-period-- a run that included the bulk of the issues between #121 & #156, I believe. The Reed/Sue divorce, though, was a HUGE conversation topic for me and my pal Bryan (via his brother's comics). And, to be brutally honest, I did have a rough time of it, 'cause it coincided w/ the very ugly breakup of my own folks' marriage. So there was a resonance that I would have preferred avoiding--- but that is life. You've also made a very good point about the apparent disinterest in properly exploring (or even using) the FF's powers more fully. Yep, one of John Byrne's best contributions was waking everyone up about just how incredibly powerful Sue actually is. Remember the whole Malice incident, which brought on a cascade of unrealized & offensive uses of her powers? Honestly, she could disable or kill anyone-- although, granted, she would never go around using lethal force. BUT-- she's able to suffocate them with a tight field OR expand a field inside someone's body or head (yick-); the fields themselves can be used as projectiles w/ considerable velocity, and if they're strong enough to withstand nuclear-level explosions, one has to assume that they'd hit w/ considerable force. A tight field around her body renders her nearly invulnerable. Who exactly could she not defeat? Given a writer that could use her potential, I believe she'd certainly be a match for at least half of those Space Avengers we've been talking about. Surfer would be the one I think she'd have the most trouble with one-on-one. Hmmmmmm. Maybe Sue would be the apt distaff member of that group? HB
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Post by bobc on Sept 2, 2010 15:33:45 GMT -5
Sorry to hear about your parent's divorce, my friend! That's always tough on a kid.
Yeah Sue Richards is one of the most unbeatable characters in Marvel. I was reading one of the more recent Essential FF volumes, and you could actually tell when a new writer came on board halfway through because Sue's abilities were going up and up and up--then suddenly she was straight back to cowering behind a fragile force field. It was really annoying. This was years before Byrne wrote the FF.
I will say one thing about Byrne's reign at Marvel--he was the guy who turned both the Wasp and Sue into FORMIDABLE characters. In fact, as much as I loved the 60's Marvel titles, the maniacal insistence of writers to keep female heroes weak was really annoying. I'm not sure whose idea it was that this would make them more popular--I guess maybe it was just the times.
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Post by humanbelly on Sept 2, 2010 16:46:26 GMT -5
In fact, as much as I loved the 60's Marvel titles, the maniacal insistence of writers to keep female heroes weak was really annoying. I'm not sure whose idea it was that this would make them more popular--I guess maybe it was just the times. Oh, I'd hazard a guess that were at least a couple of convergent factors that perpetuated this trend-! First, I'd be really surprised if the in-house/bullpen work environment itself wasn't pretty rife with clue-free machismo & chauvinism. Awwwwful lot of old-school cigar-chompers in that bunch, yes? (Although Shar probably has a better handle on the specific personalities than I do-). And these were mostly World War II-era folks, as well as guys who'd spent an adultedhood in the 50's when "a woman's place was in the home". I mean, broadly speaking, that mind-set was still prevelant 'waaaay into the 60's. Second, Stan's insistence aside, these books were still marketed towards (and being bought by) boys between the ages of 10 and 20, more or less. I think there's little doubt that the perception was that young men wouldn't be interested in female characters that they may have found "threatening" as it were. And certainly they wouldn't be able to relate to them-- or even find something familiar, for that matter. More comfortable to just perpuate the myth that they were creatures to be saved or protected. Hmm-- but I guess this is just a wordy way of making your same point: It was the times. . . HB
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Post by bobc on Sept 2, 2010 17:18:34 GMT -5
I wrote this a while back, but I'll repeat it--I distinctly recall one Marvel writer (can't remember which) saying that when he took over the Avengers, the previous writer told him that he should take great care in not making the Scarlet Witch "too powerful." I believe this was during the era when Wanda would basically pass out after one useless hex. I was shocked to read that! One of the reasons I found the New X-Men so fascinating for a while was the fact that all the women were very powerful, right up there with the guys. I mean what would a reader rather see, a Jean Grey struggling to telekinetically lift her own body weight, or a Jean Grey tearing Sentinels apart? The visual aspect of displaying her power in those mid seventies years was really exciting too--way better than the weak little dotted line that used to show her telekinetic ability! And remember when Storm fought Polaris and the entire Manhattan sky was filled with their powers clashing? now THAT was exciting!
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Post by humanbelly on Sept 6, 2010 12:46:03 GMT -5
I wrote this a while back, but I'll repeat it--I distinctly recall one Marvel writer (can't remember which) saying that when he took over the Avengers, the previous writer told him that he should take great care in not making the Scarlet Witch "too powerful." I believe this was during the era when Wanda would basically pass out after one useless hex. I was shocked to read that! One of the reasons I found the New X-Men so fascinating for a while was the fact that all the women were very powerful, right up there with the guys. I mean what would a reader rather see, a Jean Grey struggling to telekinetically lift her own body weight, or a Jean Grey tearing Sentinels apart? The visual aspect of displaying her power in those mid seventies years was really exciting too--way better than the weak little dotted line that used to show her telekinetic ability! And remember when Storm fought Polaris and the entire Manhattan sky was filled with their powers clashing? now THAT was exciting! I'm trying to think if there are any other early-Marvel female heroes at all that might prove an exception to what you've said--- but I'm really drawing a blank-- Sue-- yep, always fainting against assaults on her force-fields. Wanda-- REALLY powerful when she first joined the Avengers, then immediately went into a decline (oh, was that annoying). Jean-- very similar to Sue. Jan-- in a way, the toughest and most resolute of the bunch, but would still forget about half the time that, when endangered by a spider, bird, criminal's shoe, etc., she always had the option of growning to normal size. PLUS the whole "retaining the strength of their full-size form" aspect seemed to be routinely overlooked. Aaaaand then who else was there? Anyone before the Inhumans came on the scene? Black Widow--- except she wasn't tecnnically a superhero, she was a spy. Wow-- I can't think of anyone else, offhand. . . ! HB
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Post by bobc on Sept 6, 2010 14:00:30 GMT -5
But HB--if the Wasp remembered she had full-sized human strength when someone captured her in a glass bottle, what kind of kidnap victim would she be? Growing and breaking the bottle would also be problematic for writers who saw her as kidnapping bait. Actually Jan now is strong enough to bend a metal pole with her bare hands, thanks to the changes John Byrne did to her in Marvel Team Up way back when. I recall one letter in the early 80's in the Avengers saying how tired people were of the Wasp and Yellowjacket constantly flitting around villains but never defeating them! RIGHT! Around that time when Hank and Jan came back to the team (during the first Perez period/with a few issues by John B), they were incredibly boring and added nothing to the team. Thank GOD things improved dramatically in a few years!
And yup--The Scarlet Witch's power level was all over the place in the early years. When she first joined she was easily the most powerful on the team--in fact, she fought the Enchantress to a standstill by herself, casting hex after hex. A few years later, her hexes were so lame she almost never made a difference on the team. She also passed out after one or two hexes, which really made her more of a liability than anything. No wonder no female was ever able to carry her own book.
The first two super powerful female characters were Thundra and Valkyrie in the early 70's, although writers quickly de-powered Valkyrie. Next up were She Hulk and Storm and the updated Jean Grey. Then Wanda got a power-up. Then the Wasp.
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Post by humanbelly on Nov 10, 2010 9:28:58 GMT -5
Totally forgot about this thread! Not sure who (whom?) amongst us is reading FF, but I'm still receiving it, so I thought I'd toss out a query:
Which member is the one that's going to die this time? I imagine it hasn't been a terribly well-kept secret, but I haven't seen any direct mentions of that person's identity.
Personally, I'd say Johnny's by far the most dramatically expendable, and I think he's the only one who some sort of killing/replacing experiment hasn't been tried on already. Reed's been "killed" before (and came back). Ben was killed and Reed managed to travel to the gates of heaven itself to convince him to return-- plus Ben has been de-powered and replaced on several occassions. Sue was killed in an issue of What If-?, and has been sidelined by pregnancies before. It's all been tried, AND all three of these characters continue to be compelling, interesting, and exhibit growth and change.
Man, Johnny really doesn't. He's not particularly different as a person than he was nearly 50 (gulp!) years ago. The only time he was interesting was when he married Alycia/Lyja, in fact. I still care about the forward momentum of the other three characters (well, more or less. Haven't been thrilled w/ the writing for quite awhile--), but Johnny? Enh.
Am I heartless? Am I too cruelly dismissive of one of the Marvel Age's initial icons?
Bet I might be right, though. . .
HB
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Post by humanbelly on Nov 10, 2010 12:35:53 GMT -5
Forgot to mention earlier (well actually, my crew/staff arrived, and I had to get her started on a project. . . ) that longtime Avengers penciller, Steve Epting ("The Forgotten One", as it were) is now the FF's artist. And, boy, it's great to see an artist who has continued to develop and refine his style over the years the way he has. I like him a lot back then-- thought he was 'way underappreciated-- and he's clearly worked at improving his craft since then. Particularly worth noting is his emphasis on creating consistently recognizable faces-- something very, very few comic artists are able to master.
Now, he's credited as the artist, with the color work being by someone else. In today's industry, does that still mean he's doing his own inking. . . or. . . does inking not necessarily work the same way anymore? This sounds like a foolish question to my ears, but I thought I'd pose it, regardless.
HB
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Post by sharkar on Nov 12, 2010 12:29:27 GMT -5
Now, he's credited as the artist, with the color work being by someone else. In today's industry, does that still mean he's doing his own inking. . . or. . . does inking not necessarily work the same way anymore? This sounds like a foolish question to my ears, but I thought I'd pose it, regardless. From what I have seen, it still means the credited artist--in this case Epting--is doing the complete art (since it's one person, it may just be very rough pencils if any at all, with the bulk of the work being "finished" in the inking stage). And inking can be done digitally now, just not sure how many comic book inkers actually do that (at least for Marvel/DC). I have seen some inking credits specifically denoted as "digital" but not many. Back to the credits: You know, in the old days I just assumed the first named artist was the penciler and the second was the inker. So for years I wondered why the art of Avengers #16--with its credits of "Dashing Layouts by Jack Kirby" and "Darlin' Artwork by Dick Ayers"-- looked so, well, underwhelming to me. I mean, even as a kid it seemed like really fourth-rate Kirby to me, since I was under the impression that Kirby had penciled #16 and Ayers inked it. It wasn't until I got back into comics a few years ago that I understood how to "read" credits and that on Avengers #16 , Kirby provided sketchy layouts for Ayers and not full pencils.
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martyp
Great Lakes Avenger
Helloooo Nurse!
Posts: 31
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Post by martyp on Nov 30, 2010 13:08:30 GMT -5
Forgot to mention earlier (well actually, my crew/staff arrived, and I had to get her started on a project. . . ) that longtime Avengers penciller, Steve Epting ("The Forgotten One", as it were) is now the FF's artist. And, boy, it's great to see an artist who has continued to develop and refine his style over the years the way he has. I like him a lot back then-- thought he was 'way underappreciated-- and he's clearly worked at improving his craft since then. Particularly worth noting is his emphasis on creating consistently recognizable faces-- something very, very few comic artists are able to master. Epting rules! I have always been a fan of his work, ever since I first discovered his pencils in Avengers. His X-Factor run was awesome as well. Almost made me pick up his Crossgen work, but my wallet didn't let me. While his current style is quite different from his older style, I really love both.
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Post by bobc on Dec 23, 2010 16:22:02 GMT -5
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Post by starfoxxx on Dec 23, 2010 17:06:54 GMT -5
Thanks bobc. Typical hype--ala Secret Invasion, IMO, though. And the connected FOX POLL of "Who should die?" is just too depressing, esp. this time of year. I'd rather see a poll of "Which comic book editor-in-chief should be fired?" or maybe "Which writer should never be allowed to write mainstream comics?" Or how about which Avenger should RETURN from the dead? btw, anyone who is going to buy multiple copies of the "black-bagged" FF---think about all those "Death of Superman" black-bag copies I always see in the 25-cent bins.
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Post by bobc on Dec 23, 2010 19:04:14 GMT -5
I'm with you, Foxy.
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Post by spiderwasp on Dec 23, 2010 22:49:44 GMT -5
Wow. Why is it that the things that are supposed to get me excited with Marvel these days, just bore me? Oh, wait, I know. It's because crass commercialism and repeating the same old tired crap once or twice a year bores me. On the other hand, when the books contain intersting interaction between characters and cleverness rather than sensationalism, it gets no publicity. Give me "Avengers Academy," "Children's Crusade," "Ant-man and Wasp" or even "Pet Avengers" any day over "Marvel announces another major character will die and change the Marvel Universe forever!"
Oh, and Starfoxxx, about your poll. I can answer it easily but I think you already know all my answers.
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Post by bobc on Dec 24, 2010 17:04:44 GMT -5
Uhg. If only I could disagree.
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Post by sharkar on Dec 30, 2010 17:44:49 GMT -5
Hmmm, I wish it were Franklin or Valeria , but the announcement makes it clear it will be one of the original four. Obviously, whoever dies will be resurrected at some point. In the meantime we'll get a loooong arc a la death of Cap, which IMO yielded some interesting developments along the way. I haven't followed the FF closely in a while but this event sounds intriguing, so I think I will pick up the trade collections of Hickman's FF to bring myself up to speed ( the fact that many of the comic stores in my area are having end-of-year sales doesn't hurt!). So, I guess the announcement had its desired effect on at least one reader. And actually it's not a bad thing for me to jump on the FF bandwagon, as I'm also looking forward to seeing how Marvel commemorates the 50th anniversary of FF #1 (in its Nov. 2011 cover-dated books, or books released in August 2011). Personally, I'd say Johnny's by far the most dramatically expendable... Sounds logical, HB, especially since the Marvel U. has two other torches--Hammond and Toro-- alive and well in the Marvel U...though the impact would be greater if it were Reed, Sue, or Ben (who I gather is now in his human form). But hey, I guess if Johnny's out of the picture then moviegoers will more readily accept Chris Evans as Cap! ;D
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Post by Shiryu on Dec 30, 2010 21:15:53 GMT -5
The general consensus around the web is indeed that Johnny may be the one to die, because the other three have already "died" before, Reed and Ben in recent and very recent times. There is also a rumor that Spider-Man may replace him or whoever dies but as far as I know it has been denied.
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Post by bobc on Jan 5, 2011 12:17:32 GMT -5
I always found the Human Torch kind of boring, so I wouldn't care much--especially since they'll bring him back in a couple of months anyway. And I was just thinking that the current 15,000 Spiderman books/appearances/group affiliations isn't enough. Plus we need more Wolverine and Cowbell.
Hey have you all noticed how many books the Black Widow is suddenly in? Lucky for me, I love the character but I hope they don't ruin her by over-exposing her.
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Post by starfoxxx on Jan 5, 2011 16:22:44 GMT -5
I'm with sharkar. Kill the kids! Ha-ha. They've always been the most boring aspect of the FF.
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Post by humanbelly on Jan 5, 2011 17:44:31 GMT -5
I'm with sharkar. Kill the kids! Ha-ha. They've always been the most boring aspect of the FF. I dunno, S-Fox-- I think a pretty solid case can be made for Johnny as "Most boring FF core-member of All Time"-- even including Franklin and little Valeria (whom I personally have yet to accept as canonically valid-- just not willing to give in on that score yet. . . ). Johnny simply doesn't have any extraordinary or unusually compelling personality traits for a writer to use as a hook. He's incredibly brave and courageous in battle, yes, and self-sacrificing, and thinks pretty well on his feet (or in the air)-- but he was originally minted as a car-obsessed, mentally shallow, teenage "hot-head"-- and he seems to have grown into the predictable adult you might get from that. Intellectually lazy, immature, often narcissistic and unnecessarily cruel, and a continued tendency to have an inappropriately big mouth. Honestly, he was at his most interesting when faced w/ the real-life ethical dilemma of falling in love w/ his best buddy's girl, and then dealing w/ the fallout when she proved to be someone else entirely. But every time any writer tries to create a precedent of growth and depth, it never seems to stick when the next writer comes around. Not a bad guy at all, mind you--- but simply not compelling. It's much the same problem that the Star Brand guy had ("Ken"-- was that his name?) in the New U. Not a lot of substance to the character to back up the angst that goes w/ the superpowers. HB
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Post by starfoxxx on Jan 5, 2011 18:08:22 GMT -5
Plus we need more Wolverine and Cowbell. More cowbell, indeed. ;D Thinking of Wolvie's overexposure, i saw the solicit for WOLVERINE:THE BEST THERE IS, where Wolvie fights....Madcap? I'm sorry, if he's the best there is, why Madcap? Didn't Power Pack defeat him? Sorry, back to the FF......
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Post by bobc on Jan 6, 2011 12:31:27 GMT -5
I saw that title, Starry, and I just groaned. I mean, best at what? Cutting people into shreds? I can't, off the top of my head, think of anything else that Wolverine does that is better than what a dozen other characters can do.
Have you all seen the Super hero Squad cartoon? The FF comes off really good in that. Their powers seem to really come off better "live"--particularly Reed's.
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Post by humanbelly on Jan 26, 2011 8:36:53 GMT -5
Aaaaaaaand yes, to the surprise of almost no one, the latest mortality-challenged FF member will indeed be the Torch. I don't think this rates a spoiler warning, as it was announced yesterday on Yahoo's OMG! site in an extremely earnest, breathless, serious-business news video piece.
There's a Tom Brevoort interview (geeze, I think he's the "Marvel Character Whom I Most Physically Resemble"-!! Yikes!)-- and he talks about this event heralding huge changes in the MU and similar nonsense. I don't find him a commanding presence at all, honestly-- expected someone who exhibits a lot more depth, if nothing else. One has to wonder at this point how much he himself even believes in what he's doing. (Seems like a nice guy, though.)
There's Joe Quesada being hopelessly coy about the consequences of Johnny's death and if/when/how he'll be resurrected. (Which at this point has to be considered a screaming declaration that, yes, of course he'll be resurrected. We've already got it mapped out.)
There's talk of distraught fans--- but we really only hear from one, who doesn't come across as distraught--- more like distracted.
The hyper-earnest, grave tone of the piece is unbearable, as it somehow never mentions the many "deaths" the FF has already experienced. But, to its credit, it does directly point out that DEATH in comic books isn't such a permanent proposition, and that resurrections are for more the rule than the exception. [Actually, I think I may have just phrased it a lot better than they did-- but that was the gist of their point.]
And another shocker--- the next issue will be the final issue of Fantastic Four!!! Omigod, you heard it here first! I have no doubt that the following month will see a brand-spanking-new, get-while-its-hot, double-sized, foil-wrapped-and-embossed, collector's-item-FOR-SURE, relaunch of the THRILLING THREE or the BOMBASTIC BUNCH (if you count this horde of live-in supporting cast), or perhaps they'll jump on the still-current bandwagon and become the BAXTER BUILDING AVENGERS or some such.
August of this year (someone above has mentioned) marks the 50th anniversary of the launch of the FF. Is it even remotely possible that Johnny won't miraculously return at that very moment? Possibly with powers re-vamped-- or with new powers entirely? Perhaps having undergone some traumatic experience that will fundamentally change him? Give him some tragic depth? Yeesh-- some maturity? That---- would actually be more interesting. But I would MUCH prefer to see it happen without all of the appalling "This Issue: Someone DIES!!!" hype. Ugh.
Wow-- there's a morning rant, folks! Came right out of the blue, it did!
HB
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